batmagadanleadoff

Ike Davis - 1 Ruben Tejada - 1 Lucas Duda - 3 Daniel Murphy - 1 Marlon Byrd - 3 Omar Quntanilla - 3 Juan Lagares - 1 Eric Young - 3 Jordany Valdespin - 3 Kirk Nieuwenhuis - 2 Josh Satin -2 Justin Turner - 1 Anthony Recker - 3 John Buck - 3 Wilmer Flores - 1 Travis d�Arnaud - 1 David Wright - 1 Jenrry Mejia - 2 Jeurys Familia - 1 Bobby Parnell - 1 Jon Niese - 1 Dillon Gee - 1 Jeremy Hefner - 2 zack Wheeler - 1 Noah Syndergaard - 2 Matt Harvey - 1

Broken Harvey, broken heart By Steven Goldman "Raiders of the Lost Ark" isn't best remembered for its incisive dialogue, but there is a line at the beginning of the picture that stays with you. In an inspired teaser segment that sets the tone for the rest of the film, archaeologist Indiana Jones dodges poisonous darts, leaps over chasms, and outruns a giant stone sphere the size of a McDonald's franchise in order to recover a golden idol from a jungle temple -- at which point he is basically mugged by a rival and relieved of his hard-won trophy. "Dr. Jones," the competing archaeologist taunts, "Again we see there is nothing you can possess which I cannot take away." Baseball is like that when it comes to great young pitchers. The latest case in point is Matt Harvey of the Mets, who, we learned this afternoon, will be shelved with forearm soreness that may be indicative of a turn ulnar collateral ligament of the elbow, an injury that almost inevitably leads to Tommy John surgery. The Mets will idle Harvey in the hopes his swelling can recede and they can get a clearer picture of his innards. At this point you can bid the Mets' ace adieu for the 2013 season and there is every likelihood that some or all of 2014 will be lost as well. The Mets revolution that was going to be led by Harvey, Zack Wheeler, David Wright, and 22 other guys to be named later was always a longshot to come together, but the odds against it now seem even greater; a top three of Harvey, Wheeler, and next year's messiah, Noah Syndergaard, might have been formidable enough that the team could get by with the kind of flea market offense and bullpen Sandy Alderson has patched together this year. Last season's A's showed that a team with a strong enough pitching staff and an off-brand attack (Yoenis Cespedes had the sole standout full-season campaign, while the team got surprisingly good partial-season performances from Brandon Moss, Chris Carter, and Josh Donaldson) can win. Timing, though, is a bitch, and the Mets don't have it. Whereas catcher Travis d'Arnaud and somewhere-in-the-infield-we-swear guy Wilmer Flores are now in the majors, and sundry minor leaguers such as Brandon Nimmo, Cesar Puello (temporarily vanished via Biogenesis suspension), Dominic Smith, and others look promising, they are all developing on their own schedules and on a slower pace than the pitchers -- as they take their time filtering up to the big leagues, players such as Wright age and pitchers such as Harvey get hurt. Iceberg-like, the roster takes one step forward, two steps back. Consider this year's Kansas City Royals, who are bobbing about around the .500 mark like a cork off Cape Fear, thanks in part to a breakthrough by first baseman Eric Hosmer and some excellent work in the bullpen from closer Greg Holland as well as Luke Hochevar, Tim Collins and Aaron Crow. All five of those players will be eligible for arbitration this offseason. The Royals' payroll is already the highest in team history. While the likely departure of free agent starter Ervin Santana will free up some cash, it won't be enough to cover all the raises that are going to be due these players. Even if the Royals greatly raise their payroll ceiling, other possibilities will be foreclosed by the financial commitments the team will have to make to retain these players -- and they still won't have a championship-level club. The Royals have talent -- some of it -- but their timing is off. But this is not so much about the Mets' future as to the great unfairness of baseball, the way the most promising young pitchers are designed to dash one's hopes. Every Strasburg or Harvey that comes around is as much or more a candidate for surgery as he is the Hall of Fame. Some recover to go on to Hall of Fame-level careers anyway (Roger Clemens, assuming he ultimately makes it, is the great example here -- he had surgery to repair a torn rotator cuff in August 1985 and was still going more than 20 years later), but most just fade. It has ever been thus. There was a pitcher named Pete Donohue who came up with the Reds in 1921 who, if you're ever flipping through the old record books, might jump out at you -- he had three 20-win seasons by the age of 25. Not a lot was written about the guy at his peak and practically nothing after, but it's clear that he had just okay stuff, great command, and, like all pitchers who are at one point or another are described as a "workhorse," was incredibly durable until he wasn't. He was 103-67 (.606) with a 3.30 ERA and 1443 2/3 innings pitched through his 25th birthday and led the National League in innings pitched a couple of times, 31-51 (.378) with a 5.10 ERA in 668 2/3 innings thereafter. To update his story to modern times, add between 60 and 80 years and replace his name with that of Dwight Gooden or Mark Prior. Pretty much everything else remains the same. The history of pitching is also the history of pitching injuries, and though it seems like more hurlers than ever are undergoing surgery, it's far more likely the case that diagnostic tools have improved so dramatically that we can see the need for it more clearly than ever before. A pitcher like Donohue was doomed to meatball his sore-armed self out of the majors and eventually out of the pro ranks altogether; a pitcher such as Lefty Grove had to muddle through until he could figure out how to reinvent himself after arm problems (his came in 1934); Matt Harvey has other, presumably better options. The only problem with resigning ourselves this way is that we have something like causality with Donohue, Gooden, Prior, or all-time disabled-list champion Bret Saberhagen. We can see where their managers might have been more careful in their handling. Conversely, tyro hurlers like Harvey, Stephen Strasburg, and, most infamously, Joba Chamberlain were handled with kid gloves and got hurt anyway. Writing about Chamberlain in the 2012 edition of the Baseball Prospectus annual, I quoted Phillip K. Dick: "There is no perfect defense. There is no protection. Being alive means being exposed; it's the nature of life to be hazardous." This is still the truth of pitching. Like a cardiac patient set loose in a donut shop, their every action is inherently self-destructive. For every Clemens or Tom Seaver or CC Sabathia who can more or less hold up to the strain for a lengthy period of time between surgeries (Seaver's strikeout rate dropped in 1979, the season before he had his first real arm problems since reaching the majors in 1967 -- Sabathia should take note) there are dozens more who can't, even if they have arms touched with a combination of moonshine and lightning like Harvey. As Strasburg and dozens of other Tommy John survivors have shown over the years, up to and including ol' Tommy John himself, a pitcher can come back from this procedure and still have excellent results -- it just takes awhile, and who wants that? We have shown through our coaches, managers, and general managers that yes, we can have nice things -- give us toys of this quality and we will treat them like the collector's items they are. Alas, they break anyway. The only way to keep a pitcher whole is to not use him, just as the only surefire way to avoid dying is never to have been born. It's depressing, depressing as hell, but it's the reality of the situation. Getting too attached to any pitcher is a recipe for heartbreak -- getting too attached to anything or anyone else, too, but the pitchers go faster. As the man in the movie said, there is nothing we can possess that cannot be taken away. http://www.sbnation.com/mlb/2013/8/26/4661740/matt-harvey-injury-mets-ucl-tommy-john-surgery-depression

Baseball Prospectus on "the injury". Lotsa graphs and charts. Overthinking It A Search for Matt Harvey Injury Indicators http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=21642

Klapisch being Klapisch: A Klapischy piece. Klapisch: Mets failed to protect their phenom Matt Harvey By BOB KLAPISCH RECORD COLUMNIST Every once in a while a baseball story just explodes on you, cutting across every demographic and team affiliation. It�s not just Mets fans who are reeling from Matt Harvey�s season-ending injury, it�s anyone who loves this sport. Impossible, you say: Harvey is too young, too talented, too genetically gifted to be brought down like this. That�s what you say, knowing it�s a lie. Random injuries are woven in the contract pitchers make with the game � the countdown to a torn rotator cuff or frayed ligament starts on Day One of their careers. But that doesn�t make it any easier for the Mets to lose Harvey for 2013 or perhaps longer, depending on whether he�ll need surgery. Mets fans are in even worse shape, wondering how much more trauma the gods can possibly dole out. Harvey was supposed to be the bridge to better times in Flushing � his every 98-mph fastball teased the senses. With Harvey, Zack Wheeler and Noah Syndergaard on the way, the Mets were quietly predicting a takeover in New York by 2015. The brave, new world would orbit around one superstar � the indestructible Harvey. Now? There are a million questions trailing in his wake, starting with the Mets� passive response to the lingering forearm tightness Harvey had been experiencing since July. Warrior that he is, Harvey downplayed the discomfort, telling his bosses it was nothing unusual, nothing more than the cost of doing business with nuclear heat. But given the Mets� abysmal record of managing injuries, why weren�t they proactive when it was clear Harvey wasn�t improving? There�s nothing normal about forearm tenderness that doesn�t heal. Again, Harvey ignored every warning sign, noting, �There was no shooting pain down my arm and in my hand.� But what would�ve been the downside to slipping that arm into an MRI tube? Maybe the Mets� doctors would�ve seen inflammation in the doomed ulnar collateral ligament. Or maybe not. Maybe they could�ve warned Harvey that he was risking injury by continuing to pitch. Or maybe not; the MRI might�ve showed nothing at all. Still, the Mets should�ve taken control of the situation and not waited until late Sunday when Harvey�s pain finally became acute. Only then did doctors begin investigating, returning a diagnosis that rocked the organization to its core. Not only will Harvey miss the rest of the season, but given the likelihood that he�ll opt for Tommy John surgery in the next few weeks, it�ll be 2015 before he throws another pitch. By then, who knows what happens to the Mets� renaissance. This was supposed to be the breakthrough winter, when the Wilpon Family reaped the windfall from the Johan Santana and Jason Bay contracts. With money in their pockets, and a cadre of young, burgeoning pitchers, the Mets would�ve been poised to be players in the free-agent market. Next season was going to be a 1984-like rebirth for the franchise, after which the Mets would take the National League as their hostages in 2015. And Harvey would blossom as the latter-day Doc Gooden without the demons. Already he�s big and brash and gutsy enough to pose in ESPN The Magazine�s Body Issue. It wasn�t the smartest decision he�ll ever make, but it told you plenty about the kid�s self-confidence. Harvey said some crazy things to Men�s Journal, as well, including brazen plans for his first $200 million contract. He eventually walked back his comments, but the real Harvey � a bit larger than life � was on full display. Only he didn�t sound much like a powerbroker during Monday�s news conference at Citi Field. Mostly, Harvey wore the look of a man whose world had just been crushed by the fates. Over and over, he said nothing had alerted him to the possibility that his body would break down so early in his career. But that�s just what some scouts were saying in spring training, predicting that, despite his superb delivery and thick physique, the sheer force of his fastball meant trouble ahead. �No pitcher can throw that hard forever. It just takes too much arm speed,� said one talent evaluator. It wasn�t just the four-seam fastball, either. Harvey had in his possession an inhuman 91-mph slider he could deliver on the black. Opposing hitters would shake their heads and ask John Buck, �Are you [bleeping] me?� after Harvey had used them for calisthenics. The Mets rode the wave, but they were just as leery of Harvey someday hurtling over the cliff. They did their part to protect him. The right-hander threw only 135� innings in 2011, 169� innings between the minors and majors in 2012 and was at 173� innings this year � a perfectly tempered 24 percent increase. Harvey averaged only 103 pitches per outing this summer and never topped 121. Nothing the Mets did suggested overwork or abuse. Yet, once again, they let the player dictate the course of physical therapy. Remember, this is the team that botched its handling of injuries to Bay and Jose Reyes, and allowed David Wright to keep playing in 2011 with a broken back. Jeremy Hefner pitched with elbow pain this year until it looks like he�ll need Tommy John surgery, too. And Harvey skipped a start before the All-Star break because of that troublesome forearm. That�s all the Mets needed to know in July. Even though it was Harvey�s responsibility to be completely honest with his doctors and trainers, the Mets should�ve put him on medical-probation immediately in the second half. That forearm was never normal down the stretch and should�ve been watched more carefully. Again, maybe an early MRI would�ve yielded nothing at all. Maybe Harvey was meant to suffer this injury because his UCL was genetically programmed for only so many pitches. Still, you wouldn�t want to be in the Mets� shoes today asking: Could we have done more? http://www.northjersey.com/columnists/Klapisch_Mets_failed_their_phenom.html?page=all

1985 was a Mets season for the ages. But are you comparing 1985 to 2014?

Benjamin Grimm wrote: This whole thing sucks, but it's no reason to write off 2014 yet. Reading this thread, I see some believed 2014 was hopeless before Harvey ever felt a twinge. I thought it was outrageously presumptuous for so many to assume that a team this bad would contend in just the next season. Not that it can't happen. But hoping and expecting are two different beasts.

Let's Calm Down About Matt Harvey's Elbow By Jonah Keri on August 27, 2013 10:30 AM ET Matt Harvey is headed to the disabled list with a partially torn ulnar collateral ligament in his right elbow, wiping out the rest of this season, throwing next season into doubt, and likely derailing the Mets' near-term hopes for contention. The injury derailed Harvey's first full season in the big leagues, one that established him as one of the best pitchers in the game. If resting the elbow doesn't cut it, Harvey would face the prospect of Tommy John surgery, which might keep him off a major league mound until 2015. Given how good Harvey had become so quickly, how rough the past few years have been for the Mets, and what Harvey's well-being means for one of the most downtrodden teams in baseball, it's tough to see this as anything other than a crushing blow for everyone involved. Except it doesn't have to be that way. This isn't going to be another bury-the-Mets opus in which we catalog everything from Bernie Madoff to Jason Bay to the sad end of Johan Santana's career. This is a story of optimism, silver linings, and the miracles of medical science, about how sometimes shit happens, then everyone gets over it. Contrary to some (misguided) Internet ramblings, the Mets didn't do anything wrong here. When something this dramatic happens, the natural impulse is to find a scapegoat. One Twitter naysayer wondered why the Mets would let Harvey throw 110 or more pitches in one-third of his starts this year, given the Mets have been out of the playoff race since, well, Opening Day, more or less. There were less-specific complaints (that I'm not going to link to) about the Mets being at fault � somehow. If you dig deep enough, you can find a few warning signs. GM Sandy Alderson noted that Harvey had felt forearm pain "for some time now." As ESPN Stats & Info notes, Harvey threw the hardest fastball, the hardest slider, and the hardest curveball of any qualified starting pitcher this year; the velocity on all three of those pitches had fallen in August, according to the excellent pitcher analysis site Brooks Baseball. Also per Brooks, Harvey's vertical release point dipped this month. A sore forearm, diminished velocity, and lower release points can be red flags when it comes to potential injuries. But if every pitcher shut it down every time he felt a twinge, lost a tick off his fastball, or dropped his arm by an inch or two, professional baseball would cease to exist. Harvey had posted a 2.97 ERA with a 27-to-2 strikeout-to-walk rate over five starts in August. Nine out of 26 starts with 110-plus pitches thrown is hardly excessive for a pitcher who'd thrown well enough to post double-digit complete games this season if the Mets had let him. With a cap of roughly 200 to 205 innings this year (210-215 at the absolute most), the Mets planned to shut Harvey down after four or five more starts anyway. There's a balance to be struck between responsibly managing a young pitcher's workload and letting him develop stamina, work deep into games, and figure out how to get out of jams. The Mets did fine on that front. But no matter how judicious a team might be, no matter how much of a physical specimen he might be, shit just happens. Mark Mulder ? @markmulder20 Everyone thinks good mechanics prevent arm injury. Doesn't matter people. Either you get lucky or you don't. 4:04 PM - 26 Aug 2013 150 Retweets 51 favorites Harvey might be best off getting the surgery over with sooner rather than later. We're not going to go too far in playing doctor here. Every pitcher is different, and we don't know how "partially" torn Harvey's UCL is. Still, just about any pitcher you can think of who had this injury has required Tommy John surgery at some point. Most pitchers, like the Dodgers' Chad Billingsley, won't make it more than a few months before being forced to go under the knife. Someone like Adam Wainwright, who pitched more than five years with a partial tear, is an extremely rare exception. Given that Harvey is just 24 years old, with multiple potential big years and massive potential earning power ahead of him, it makes lots of sense to get the procedure done in the near future. Again, ask those who've either seen many teammates and rivals suffer the same injury and go in for Tommy John � http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/72614/lets-calm-down-about-matt-harveys-elbow

Edgy MD wrote: Yeah, the Stones thing is batmagadan's gig, but I hope he doesn't mind me butting in for a cameo. Be my guest. I was saving this title for the next round of gubbernment strong-arm tactics at Willets Point.

Lotsa optimists here, that's for sure. I don't know where this originated from that it's supposed to be a foregone conclusion that the Mets will contend in 2014, 2015 at the latest (probably the same Orwellian Mets forces that once brainwashed the media into regarding Rey Ordonez as Ozzie Smith like). It might happen, and I'll surely be rooting for it. But this team has no offense, none. For whatever reasons, David Wright, their best hitter, hasn't been the 30 HR perennial MVP candidate that he used to be since Shea Stadium was torn down, and that'll be six seasons ago in 2014. Wright'll be on the wrong side of 30 next year, his durability perhaps in decline. The team's pinning their hopes on a bunch of pitchers in their early 20's --the shakiest of baseball foundations -- most of whom are still in the minors. There's no apparent hitting star on the immediate horizon now that d'Arnaud is here. It's just as likely that the team will suck for years and years more. I don't think the Mets are any closer to putting a strong team on the field than they were three or four years ago.

"What am I supposed to do now? This was the best gig I've had since I died".

Who wins? I don't know. I like 'em all. I didn't consider naming the thread for a specific player, even though I did that for the Pirates cards thread. So that was a pleasant surprise. And this Leiter entry: "She Said Youse Can Go Fuck Yourself" I love it even though I don't get it. So I need more time. Or more entries.

Kong76 wrote: You're as hooked as any of us are, so save your yucks at our expense wise guy. I don't deny that, but I don't think you get this exchange.

Kong76 wrote: Ashie62 wrote: After 47 years I would so love to blow this team off... See ya tomorrow

Frayed Knot wrote: Ashie62 wrote: After 47 years I would so love to blow this team off... You're welcome to at any time. Ha! I'm LMAO. Ha Ha. Guffaw. ROFL.

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Edinson Volquez cut loose by Padres. What the hell happened to this guy? After his first full season, he looked like he'd be an all-star for years to follow.

The Baseball Gods have been unmercifully cruel to the Mets in recent years, haven't they?

... and the harder they throw, the greater the risk.

Bryan Cranston can do bald super-villains. Heisenberg is slated to play the role of Lex Luthor in the upcoming Batman/Superman flick. http://www.webpronews.com/bryan-cranston-role-announcement-outshines-affleck-2013-08

While this certainly sounds bad, I'm waiting to hear this confirmed by somebody other than Mike Francesa. ESPN cites a "team source": Matt Harvey has tear in elbow New York Mets starter Matt Harvey has a partial UCL tear in his elbow and is headed for the disabled list, according to a team source. It is not certain if Harvey will have to go undergo Tommy John surgery, the source said. Harvey was 9-5 in 2013 with a 2.27 ERA and 191 strikeouts, good for fourth in the league. He started July's All-Star Game for the National League. Information from ESPNNewYork.com's Adam Rubin was used in this report. http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/9602399/matt-harvey-new-york-mets-partial-tear-elbow-source-says _________ That's what I first thought after the initial shock of the injury: Mike Francesca?

He was also the AL starting pitcher in this year's ASG. Saturday's game was the first time in baseball history that the two starting pitchers from the same ASG faced each other in the regular season. Gooden and Clemens, the '86 ASG starters, faced each other in that year's WS.

bump

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: ooooh, Los Mets en Los Orango Uniformas. Senor Harvey no bueno. Mucho macho! If the Mets weren't pinching pennies, Jeff woulda also had 'em in matching orange pants.