Memories of Dan Warthen AKA the Warthen Appreciation Thread

[A Boy Named Seo]

Unfairly and constantly shit on by Ceetar Warthen kinda went from "Who's this effing guy?" to sneaky baseball innovator with his self-titled slider.

As the Mets charged to the World Series, Fangraphs wrote this glowing piece about Warthen's signature pitch:

Ask Warthen if he’s in his dream job, and he doesn’t equivocate. “Absolutely. All of these guys are good guys, too, and they want to learn. Syndergaard and Matz and Harvey — they’re just sponges, and they want to learn.” That’s no surprise. You’d hope most pitchers would want to learn the low-spin, high-velocity, all-in-the-fingers slider that helped make Matt Harvey, Jacob deGrom, Jeurys Familia and Jenrry Mejia who they are today. That’s a pitch good enough to get its own name: The Dan Warthen Slider.

Shit's not so sweet when everyone's hurt and the team sucks. Fangraphs this year on the Warthen slider:

The Mets’ fate over the past few years has been tied closely to the quality of the pitching staff. Once a clear strength of the club, that staff represented a weakness for this year’s team. But much of that weakness was a product of injury, and injuries hit every team at a seemingly random pace. Is Warthen a scapegoat here, or is he somehow directly responsible for the current situation?

Innovator? Just a dude? I feel like he mighta been underrated and overrated both. Memories of Warthen NOW!!!!

[metirish]

Great coach when things were going well, shite when they weren't, such is the life of a pitching coach. Seeemd a very likeable man though.,

Edited October 3, 2017 by Guest

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

I probably still have half a dozen of these cards in my "Expos" pile.



Would not have guessed he'd be better and last longer than the guy he replaced, Rick "The Jacket" Peterson.

Ceets got all over him when he gave John Maine the jocky tough love. Glad to see he's been offer a job but he may not take it.

[Guest d'Kong76]

Did youse guys see this (on Sunday, I think)...
[youtube:1ckyxp6m]5Q4Yk3TXAXs[/youtube:1ckyxp6m]

[Lefty Specialist]

Warthen was originally making retirement noises but wanted to come back so as not to go out on such a sour note. Sorry, Dan.

His pitchers seemed to like him (especially deGrom & Syndergaard), so he couldn't have been all bad. Wonder if that 'Warthen Slider' he taught had something to do with injuries over the years, though.

[Ceetar]

I hope he sticks around and teaches mechanics/sliders to the prospects and what not. Most of what I was skeptical of was in-game stuff and season prep, which he won't be affecting anymore.

In retrospect I wonder of the Maine/habitual liar comment was a cover for Manuel being an idiot and starting a guy that was having pregame issues with no backup guy warming and then only giving him one batter to work it out and changing his mind.

[Edgy MD]

He lasted 9 1/2 years, for somebody who seemed to be just given the job mid-season as an interim when Peterson was let go. I would guess that's the longest tenure of any Met coach since the remaining guys from Gil Hodges staff who ultimately got fired along with Joe Torre.

Maybe Harrelson gets a longer tenure if you add his coaching career and his managerial career, but I don't think so.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Ceetar wrote: I hope he sticks around and teaches mechanics/sliders to the prospects and what not. Most of what I was skeptical of was in-game stuff and season prep, which he won't be affecting anymore. In retrospect I wonder of the Maine/habitual liar comment was a cover for Manuel being an idiot and starting a guy that was having pregame issues with no backup guy warming and then only giving him one batter to work it out and changing his mind.

I'm pretty sure it was clear then and especially now the "liar" comment was an accurate take on Maine's denial of his own physical woes. This was not controversial!

[Ceetar]

woes that the Mets kept telling him were nothing, and were Manuel and Warthen's job to work with or overrule.

[Guest John Cougar Lunchbucket]

Were it nothing they wouldn;t have removed him from a game after 5 pitches and never use him again

[G-Fafif]

Edgy MD wrote: He lasted 9 1/2 years, for somebody who seemed to be just given the job mid-season as an interim when Peterson was let go. I would guess that's the longest tenure of any Met coach since the remaining guys from Gil Hodges staff who ultimately got fired along with Joe Torre. Maybe Harrelson gets a longer tenure if you add his coaching career and his managerial career, but I don't think so.

Mel Stottlemyre lasted ten seasons, 1984 through 1993, so a little longer than Warthen. Harrelson was coach/manager consecutively from 1985, when he replaced Bobby V in or near the third base box, until the second-to-last weekend of 1991. Buddy also spent a year on Bamberger's staff, in '82, before moving to the SportsChannel booth in '83. He managed Little Falls in 1984 and Columbia in early '85. In his autobiography, he rued ever taking the big league managing job, speculating that if he hadn't, he could have had one of those forever coaching runs, like Frankie Crosetti had with the MFYs.

Clean slate years, with new manager and pitching coach taking over to start a season:

1962: Casey Stengel and Red Ruffing
1968: Gil Hodges and Rube Walker
1982: George Bamberger and Bill Monbouquette
1984: Davey Johnson and Mel Stottlemyre
2002: Art Howe and Vern Ruhle
2017: TBD and TBA

[Ceetar]

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Were it nothing they wouldn;t have removed him from a game after 5 pitches and never use him again

he got an MRI after the season from a different angle (in Philly) that revealed a tear that they couldn't see.

my point was they should've either not let him pitch, or let him pitch more than 5 pitches. THAT was the failure. They admitted that he was having issues in the bullpen before the game. But they let the player dictate his health "I feel fine coach" and then blamed him for not coming through. If he pulls himself from that game, and the Mets couldn't find anything wrong, the quote wouldn't have been about him being a gamer that always lies to get into the game, but a wuss that always pulls himself from them.

[Edgy MD]

He didn't have to "pull himself from the game." He just would have had to stop fighting their attempts to sit him down.

Of all the controversies, this is about as empty as it gets. Even the alleged insult actually contained something of an implied compliment.

[Guest Mets Willets Point]

Still don't know if the Warthen is related to the Warthog.