You got to feel bad for Zambrano

[metirish]

Great memory Edgy, hard to believe that any team gave Bell a two year $9M contract after being with the Mets.

[Zvon]

These quotes are from the NY Daily News:

[Trachsel's Out-Adam Rubin]

...Zambrano has a lifetime 2-0 record and 0.82 ERA in 3 appearences at Dolphins Stadium. Randolph said he had challanged Zambrano before his last start, and that Zambrano responded by limiting Arizona to one run in 8 innings.....
....The GM (Omar) added that the decision was left to Randolph and pitching coach Rick Peterson........

[ As rotation spins, Steve sent off Trach- Lisa Olsen]

Those who prefer a bit of nostalgia and rational thought with their box score must be wondering what the Mets manager and pitching coach are mixing with their breakfast cereal. Trachsel is the clubs second most senior player (behind Mike Piazza, another old timer who's being shown the door); Trachsel's diligent work to return to the big leagues just five months after back surgery (doctors expected him to be sidelined all season) should count for afew bonus points. And then there's his brilliant two-hitter over eight innings Trachsel tossed against the giants, whatever thats worth.
Those who dare peek beyond what is already a frenetic wild card race will understand why Zanbrano gets the ball against the Marlins, a team just one game ahead of the Mets in the NL east. Zambrano is a sharp angle of these New Mets, and there are considerable ego's and reputations relying on his success. The Mets dealt prize prospect Scott Kazmir for Zambrano in 2004, a trade many believe bears the fingerprints of Peterson, the Mets pitching coach. And there's Zambrano's lifetime 2-0 record at Dolphin Stadium, as well as his superb last start, whatever thats worth.........
________________________________________________

Im not saying anything here, just passing this on.

I will say that Kazmir should be a mute point.

He had a big head that has yet to grow into his talent, and that wasnt going to happen on the big stage in NYC any time soon.
His numbers so far in the bigs reflect that, no matter who he is pitching for. He may someday mature to be the pitcher he can potentially be, but the Mets wanted an experienced big league arm, they wanted it now, and they didnt like Kazmirs attitude at the time. If he ever makes that list of top ten worst Met trades ever, Ill eat another one of my Met hats. I believe he was no big loss.

(I did trade back for him in EAsMVP/Baseball2005 playing in owners mode, and he did win over 20 games as a Met starter, but I also play 2nd base on that team and won the rookie of the year award. Pedro went 28-1. Wish in one hand and rub pine tar in the other.)

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Frayed Knot wrote: And can we please have a discussion involving Zambrano without re-arguing the Kaz/Zam trade as if there are people here who supported it at the time and still are carrying a torch for it's merit.

From my original post: "the arrogance of the organization that is continually soiling itself to show us how smart they were and how dumb us fans were to complain about the deal of last July".

[Guest KC]

>>>arrogance of the organization that is continually soiling itself to show us how smart they were and how dumb us fans were to complain about the deal of last July<<<

I guess I have trouble relating to the anger level, the huge dissapointment
factor, the dimay over front office imcompetence, the feeling of them trying
to dupe and fool the fans? The Hardy Boys had more compelling cases.
The Kazmir Cover-up, in bookstores today. And be sure to wear a
disguise when you check out, they're monitoring who purchases the book.

[MFS62]

Johnny Dickshot wrote: 5) Trade value: Trachsel's nearly evaporated with the dreaded back injury, only to spike with a great start. It'll likely fall from here.

Yesterday, there was an item on ESPN Radio that Buster Olney is reporting the the Mets and Red Sox are into heavy negotiations over a deal involving Traschell.

Later

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

I wish KC and FK would get it together--did we denounce the Kazmir/Zambrano deal with a single voice, or do we have

KC wrote:
trouble relating to the anger level, the huge dissapointment
factor, the dimay over front office imcompetence, the feeling of them trying
to dupe and fool the fans? The Hardy Boys had more compelling cases.
The Kazmir Cover-up, in bookstores today. And be sure to wear a
disguise when you check out, they're monitoring who purchases the book.

I'm confused. KC seems to argue that some of us might have rashly expressed mild disapproval at the tme but quickly came around to seeing Peterson's abiding wisdom in all matters relating to pitching*, while FK seems to think that of course we all voiced vehement derision on the deal, but are struggling to maintain an even keel as we continue to labor under the heavy burden that the deal continues to bear down on us.**





* heavy dose of exaggeration-for-effect here. Do not take literally. Do not operate heavy machinery while reading this.

** read previous direction carefully. Do not argue with BS about literal content--take only for general import.

[Guest KC]

I ain't really arguing anything. I think the callers, posters, and writers who
think that the decisions made by a baseball team, such as who the sixth
starter is going to be (really, c'mon this isn't nuclear arms or continental
famine) base these decisions on trying to cover up past mistakes (actual,
unrealized, or imagined) sound like a bunch of delusional paranoids who
nine times out of ten prolly have nothing better to do than pot stir, seek
attention, and beat dead horses. If I'm wrong, in this case, then I of course
apologize and recognize that you are a rare exception. *

* all callers, posters, and writers - no one in particular.

[Guest Edgy DC]

This should go in the "So You Think You're a Sportswriter" thread, as Lisa Lisa and Cult Jam seems as off-"Trach" as any of the Mets braintrust.

]Those who prefer a bit of nostalgia and rational thought with their box score must be wondering what the Mets manager and pitching coach are mixing with their breakfast cereal. Trachsel is the clubs second most senior player (behind Mike Piazza, another old timer who's being shown the door); Trachsel's diligent work to return to the big leagues just five months after back surgery (doctors expected him to be sidelined all season) should count for afew bonus points. And then there's his brilliant two-hitter over eight innings Trachsel tossed against the giants, whatever thats worth.

The first two of those are pretty-much irrelevant. We're in a pair of playoff races here.

The last is the real argument, but she treats it as the least part of a greater argument.

]Those who dare peek beyond what is already a frenetic wild card race will understand why Zanbrano gets the ball against the Marlins, a team just one game ahead of the Mets in the NL east. Zambrano is a sharp angle of these New Mets, and there are considerable ego's and reputations relying on his success.

Well, she gets points for an interesting metaphor with that sharp angle business, but then she loses a decade's worth of respect from MFS62 by sticking one of those egregious apostrophe plurals in there with ego's.

]The Mets dealt prize prospect Scott Kazmir for Zambrano in 2004, a trade many believe bears the fingerprints of Peterson, the Mets pitching coach. And there's Zambrano's lifetime 2-0 record at Dolphin Stadium, as well as his superb last start, whatever thats worth.........

Apart from dealing innuendo in lieu of fact she tosses off legitimate baseball concerns as an afterthought, when, if she wanted to slam the Mets more fairly, would analyze whether that lifetime record and that "superb" last start is really better to bet on than Trachsel's even more superb last start.

And, of course, this shouldn't be framed as exclusively Trachsel versus Zambrano. Seo has bullpen experience, but certainly seems too red hot to move right now, but Kris Benson seems hurt and Tom Glavine seems old.

And, of course, a six-man rotation remains a legit alternative.

[Elster88]

At what point does Willie stop worrying about how Trachsel feels about missing a lot of time between starts, and how Zambrano will deal with his move to the bullpen, and say to them: "STFU, stop talking to the media, and pitch when I tell you. I am your father!!"

Maybe he's already done this.

_____________________________
This post was made under the posting designation 170) Barry Lyons

[Guest Edgy DC]

Not a bad strategy.

I'm starting to glean that Lisa O's work was hastily transcribed, rather than cut and pasted, and so the punctuation errata weren't her own.

[Guest Bret Sabermetric]

Generally, a mistake to come down too heavily on daily journalists for typos, which are rarely of their making, as are the (often inflammatory)heds to (comparatively benign) articles.

[Zvon]

Edgy DC wrote: .... but then she loses a decade's worth of respect from MFS62 by sticking one of those egregious apostrophe plurals in there with ego's.

LMAO :lol: :lol: :lol:

That wasnt a cut and paste job. I actually had to copy it by hand.

Thats more than likely my mistake there. :lol: sorry.