2006: Free Agents, Options, Trades

[Guest Johnny Dickshot]

Not to mention the 1st time we'd seen Peterson mentioned as someone who might have improved Kazmir as opposed to someone doomed to witness his eventual elbow-ectomy.

[Vic Sage]

]Although Kazmir hasn't been what everyone's expected in TB,

he's been EXACTLY what people expected... an erratic young strikeout pitcher, with obvious upside that may or may not develop. Anybody expecting him to step out of AAn and be Doc Gooden wasn't really paying attention to his minor-league production. In an organization with a deeper pitching staff and less desperation, he'd have started in AAA this year, and, presuming he did well, have had a late season call up. They pushed his schedule up a year. We'll see how that works out. Too early to tell.

]I think he would have thrived under Rick Peterson.

This sounds like the groundwork being laid to be able to blame the Mets even if they were right and Kazmir never develops. "well, he would've been great if we kept him and he got to work with Rick "fix him in a minute" Peterson.", disgruntled Mets "fans" will claim.

I hope you'll use your great powers of prescience for the forces of good, not for evil.

[Guest MrMet420]

Prob not, not say he was goin to be great, just much more developed as a young pitcher under RP, after what he did in Oakland. As for your "Fix-It in a minute" RP, hasn't done, is exactly that.....Zambrano has been here for more than a minute; and while he has improved, he is extremely erratic, sometimes dominating sometimes wild.

[Guest MrMet420]

Can someone tell me why people come on these Message Boards just to rip people's messages apart; and make themselves feel big?

[Guest OlerudOwned]

MrMet420 wrote: Can someone tell me why people come on these Message Boards just to rip people's messages apart; and make themselves feel big?

boo-hoo

[Guest Edgy DC]

Well Vic likes to beat his chest and make his sound, it's true. But it's a forum for exchange. You post your ideas publickly, and you expose them to a counter-argument.

If Vic has bitten into one of your posts, all I can say is welcome to a club with a very impressive roster.

[Elster88]

MrMet420 wrote: Can someone tell me why people come on these Message Boards just to rip people's messages apart; and make themselves feel big?

Eh, don't take it personally. Stick around and continue posting, you'll like it here.

[MFS62]

Welcome.
And, as AL Jolson said in The Jazz Singer, "you ain't see nnothing yet."

Later

[Vic Sage]

i don't come here JUST to rip people's messages apart... it's merely an ancillary activity i engage in for the pure, unadulterated joy of it.

mostly i come here (as i have for many years) to join my friends in amiably obnoxious banter, to enhance my understanding of this great game of ours and cultivate an online comraderie that has spilled over into our real lives.

If you want to add some research, some information, some educated insight into the ongoing conversation we're engaged in, or just some amusing material (haikus are always welcome!), you'll be greeted with open arms.

But if you just offer unsupportable opinions or unsupported assertions, you're posts are likely to be mocked.

Anyway, i can't do you any actual harm, you know. You're there and i'm here. So stop whining, and either swim in the pool or don't.

[Vic Sage]

]Well Vic likes to beat his chest and make his sound, it's true

oooga ooooga

[MFS62]

A while ago, we actually got into a discussion of the term "loveable curmudgeon".

Later

[Elster88]

Vic Sage wrote: i don't come here JUST to rip people's messages apart... it's merely an ancillary activity i engage in for the pure, unadulterated joy of it. mostly i come here (as i have for many years) to join my friends in amiably obnoxious banter, to enhance my understanding of this great game of ours and cultivate an online comraderie that has spilled over into our real lives. If you want to add some research, some information, some educated insight into the ongoing conversation we're engaged in, or just some amusing material (haikus are always welcome!), you'll be greeted with open arms. But if you just offer unsupportable opinions or unsupported assertions, you're posts are likely to be mocked. Anyway, i can't do you any actual harm, you know. You're there and i'm here. So stop whining, and either swim in the pool or don't.

I agree with everything you said here, though maybe a newbie won't be as scared if you're a little gentler?

Unless your point is to scare off those who post, as you say, "unsupportable opinions or unsupported assertions". I agree with that goal, though I think one post is a little early to be judging Mr. Met.

Of course, after rereading your post, you really weren't judging Mr. Met, just his post. I guess I have no point.

Kudos to Mr Met for showing up though, it must be tough to work up the energy to post when you have to dance and fling t-shirts around Shea 81 times a year.

[Guest cooby]

Mr Met, I love you! and we have a whole thread devoted to your picture...

http://cybermessageboard.ehost.com/getalife/viewtopic.php?t=784


Don't look unless you're logged in though

[smg58]

Welcome Mr. Met!

Kazmir has a 4.04 ERA, very respectable in the AL East, and it's 3.21 over the last ten games. The DH alone adds half a run a game to AL totals, plus three of his division rivals have loaded lineups. Pedro's ERA in that division was only 3.99 last year, so don't assume a 4 ERA is bad. Given that he's 21 and would have started the year in AAA if he played for a better team, there's no reason to have expected more.

Zambrano has a 4.14 ERA. I like Zambrano -- he's given the Mets a lot of quality starts this year, and I think Mets' fans should refrain from holding the deal against him and be grateful we have something decent to show for it -- but Kazmir is better right now.

Bannister has had a great season and appears to have a major league future. The problem is that it looks likely that Mets will have room for only one of Seo, Bannister, and Heilman in the rotation next year, and right now I'd have to lean towards Seo. It would be in the best interests of the team and all three pitchers if the Mets deal two of them to teams that would use them as starters and get players at positions that the Mets need more. If Bannister gets us Lyle Overbay or Chad Tracy, for example, I'd have to say yes.

[Guest Edgy DC]

]The DH alone adds half a run a game to AL totals, plus three of his division rivals have loaded lineups.

Not to dismiss Kazmir's run, because I don't mean to, I'm going to go ahead and be a little skeptical about that factoid.

[smg58]

I did read half a run somewhere (I'm guessing espn.com), but it was a while ago and I can't give you a specific source off the top of my head. Some of the sabermetricians here could probably give a more precise number, but the difference between a DH and a pitcher batting has to be taken into consideration when comparing pitchers in different leagues.

[Frayed Knot]

Yes, although as of around the mid-season point this year, the NL was actually out-scoring the AL on a per/game basis.
Not sure if that's kept up and it certainly would be the exception rather than the rule if it did.

[Guest Edgy DC]

]...but the difference between a DH and a pitcher batting has to be taken into consideration when comparing pitchers in different leagues.

No doubt. I'm just unsure about that degree.