Frayed Knot

... or so claims FOX Sports Ken Rosenthal. Official announcement to come by the end of the week. Unusual to say the least to retire off a 20-win season, particularly when it's his one and only. But I guess he goes out on top and sticking around just to get 300 wins (he has 270) means two more seasons at least and possibly three. Short of HoF status IMO but a real nice career which will probably be appreciated everywhere except the Bronx where he'll be blamed for never winning. I can't wait to hear the logic about how he only was able to win 20 this year because they weren't in first and the pressure was off. I guess this increases the odds that Pettitte returns.

Yeah, in June of '07 Fuentes was cruising along with a sub-2.00 ERA and 20 saves vs 2 blown when he ran into the closer's week from hell: 6/22 @ Tor: 1/3 IP, 3 runs (2 ER) on 4 hits (Blown save + Loss) 6/25 @ Chi: 2/3 IP, 2 runs (0 ER) on 3 hits (Blown Save + Loss) 6/28 @ Hou: 2/3 IP, 4 runs on 3 hits + 1 BB, 1 HR (Blown Save + Loss) 6/29 @ Hou: 2/3 IP, 2 runs on 1 hits + 1 BB, 1 HR (Blown Save + Loss) 7/1 @ Hou: 1 IP, 2 runs on 2 hits + 2 BBs (non-save situation) That stretch of consecutive appearences (5 games, 3-1/3 IP, 13 runs (10 earned) 13 hits for 4 blown saves/walk-off losses) was enough to jack his ERA from 1.89 to 4.17 and get him pulled from the closer's role. He wasn't used in a 9th inning save situation for the remainder of the year although he only gave up 4 runs on 13 hits in the next 25 outings (1.46 ERA).

Looks like they're resigned to snagging one or the other so I'm not going to go nuts over which one. I guess all other things being equal you'd have to go with Rodriguez seeing as how he's younger and theoretically better - even if the whispers about losing stuff start to worry you and Fuentes did what he did in Coors Field. As far as the contract, I generally don't care how much money these guys make at least until it affects other potential moves. To that extent I usually worry more about the length of the deals than the per/year dollars so I suspect they'll grab the first one who agrees to what they consider reasonable terms. Below is an "average" season (70 IPs) for each (with Wags thrown in) boiled down from 2006-2008. ---HERBBKHRWHiPERAK-Rod5218329041.202.31Fuentes5324267861.133.09Wagner5419208461.062.40

I don't think it's a balk, nor do I think it's a pitch. I don't think the batter is allowed to hit it (although how is he to know that?) so I'm thinking interference, dead ball, runners return.

Now we know where the floor is on Ollie Perez negotiations.

I don't think the stats hounds are going to like this one as they'll likely think Pedroia is getting too much credit for being "scrappy", "gritty", or just plain short. But he really did have a great year and he's the only middle infielder of the top contenders. Ton 'o doubles, good SB pct, etc. Player1st2nd3rd4th5thPointsPedroia166410317Morneau77633257Youkilis24492201Mauer28134188Quentin01484160F. Rodriguez12616143Hamilton00223112A. Rodriguez0000145C. Pena0010244 Also: G. Sizemore - 42 E. Longoria - 38 C. Lee - 24 M. Cabrera - 17 V. Guerrero - 16 J. Dye - 14 A. Huff - 12 M. Bradley - 9 J. Bartlett - 5 M. Mussina - 3 R. Ibanez - 1 I. Suzuki - 1 M. Teixeira - 1 TB SS Jason Bartlett got one vote - a 5th place vote! Nice defensive shortie on a good story team and getting his glove allowed them to move Iwamura to 2B and bring up Longoria and really improve the overall team 'D' ... but the guy barely hit his weight. THAT'S what you call going overboard with the "glue that holds the team together" angle.

- So Seaver's father was tied up in industry. - DeVito's father may have been too short to serve. - And who knows what the rules were in Canada that allowed Lorne Michaels father to be lazing around the house in early 1944 Now we just need to figure out what Boeheim's father was up to that contributed to this pre-baby boomlet.

Affeldt was a 'Type B' FA too meaning no loss of draft pick (Cincy will pick up a supplemental). Virtually all of the other relievers being looked (including many of the non-closers) at would cost a Mets a 1st rounder -- assuming arb were offered and all that.

="metirish":kmt911pg]="Benjamin Grimm":kmt911pg]I have no idea who Jim Boeheim is.[/quote:kmt911pg] I knew the name but googled to make sure, he is the basketball coach at Syracuse .[/quote:kmt911pg] And has been so for like the last million years. ESPN's 'PTI' program always mentions a sport or pop culture related birthday during its close and used Boeheim yesterday (not surprising that a college hoops coach trumps a Tom Seaver on the planet of ESPN). I just happened to hear about Michaels on the radio yesterday and the age coincidence struck me. Then in re-checking Michaels' age I saw DeVito's also. I suspect that 4 people as famous as them sharing a same-day/same-year b-day is rare - especially in an era with fewer births due to so many men being overseas. (So what were their fathers doing anyway?) Edgy DC Nov 18 2008 11:03 AM Charlie Seaver's war years from stanfordmensgolf.com: After Stanford, Seaver moved to Fresno, California in 1939. He worked for many years in the California food industry, and at his suggestion, raisins were first added to breakfast cereals. While in Fresno, Seaver won the Fresno City Amateur Championship six times, winning four consecutive titles from 1945 through 1948, and again in 1950 and 1954. In 1949, he started what would extend to 39 consecutive appearances in the Bing Crosby (now AT & T) National Pro-Am tournament. Teaming with professional Mike Fetchik (winner of the Western Open) in 1964, Seaver won the pro/am division by one stroke over Tony Lema and John Durkin. Seaver served on the Board of Directors of the NCGA and he was elected its president in 1980.He was born in 1911, so he would have been 30 when Pearl Harbor hit. They were drafting up to 45, but I'm guessing the draft boards were looking for men under 30 first. With a Princeton/Stanford education and leadership in a crucial industry --- dried food --- he was probably seen as more valuable on the home front. John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 18 2008 11:25 AM Two scoops of interesting stuff. Frayed Knot Nov 18 2008 11:39 AM - So Seaver's father was tied up in industry. - DeVito's father may have been too short to serve. - And who knows what the rules were in Canada that allowed Lorne Michaels father to be lazing around the house in early 1944 Now we just need to figure out what Boeheim's father was up to that contributed to this pre-baby boomlet. Willets Point Nov 18 2008 12:55 PM Lorne Michael's father probably had already been serving for 5 years and came home on leave. soupcan Nov 18 2008 01:23 PM Boeheim's dad was a leader in another crucial industry - amusement park shilling. metirish Nov 18 2008 01:27 PM I really dig how threads at this place can turn informative and funny and interesting in a short time.

Large hands is usually an advantage in throwing the flutterball and, even though the Japanese ball is slightly smaller than MLB's, I can't imagine a 5-footer has very big paws.

Born same day/same year: Tom Seaver, Jim Boeheim, Lorne Michaels, Danny DeVito

MVP votes actually go to 10 places on a 14 points for 1st place, then 9, 8, 7, ... 1 for 2nd thru 10th, but I didn't feel like going nuts with the chart. Player1st2nd3rd4th5thPoints Pujols1810210369Howard128601308Braun02355139M. Ramirez02472138Berkman02441126Sabathia04512121Wright02143115Lidge20204104Delgado0051296A. Ramirez0002466 Also: H. Ramirez - 55 total points Chipper Jones - 44 G. Soto - 41 J. Santana - 30 (including 1 2nd place vote) C. Utley - 30 R. Ludwick - 17 B. Webb - 14 A. Gonzalez - 13 M. Holliday - 13 P. Fielder - 11 D. Lee - 10 C. Beltran - 10 (1 5th) T. Lincecum - 9 J. Reyes - 3 J. Valverde - 3 S. Drew - 2 N. McLouth - 1 In the Ramirez race it was Manny to win, Aramis to show, and Hanley to place For Mets it was MVP voters = Wright, Delgado, Santana, Beltran, Reyes CPF voters (tentative) = Santana, Wright, Beltran, Reyes, Delgado

="SteveJRogers":368piq4i]="Frayed Knot":368piq4i]IOW, once folks decide they dislike something it's easy to find specifics to justify it.[/quote:368piq4i] Ditto with the Rivera hate on this board. We hate the Yankees, Rivera was involved with a tragic accident on his property, MY GOD, RIVERA IS A MURDERER![/quote:368piq4i] You're embarrassing yourself again. SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 10:25 AM ="metirish"]] it is about getting your hands dirty and doing the work. If I'm paying him $15 million a year I don't want him doing the work , is he like laying blocks , that could be dangerous , he could break a finger , mixing cement? , he could hurt his shoulder.. I was being metaphorical, obviously he isn't the one doing that kind of heavy lifting. Probably more in line with minister duties, making sure goods and foods are delievered, organizing, etc. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 10:27 AM ="SteveJRogers":7s915vro]You asked where the Met-Hate comes from, I'm clarifing it for you by holding up a fucking mirror.[/quote:7s915vro] And it wasn't me that asked. SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 10:30 AM ="Edgy DC":3mhnvlei]="SteveJRogers":3mhnvlei]You asked where the Met-Hate comes from, I'm clarifing it for you by holding up a fucking mirror.[/quote:3mhnvlei] And it wasn't me that asked.[/quote:3mhnvlei] Fair enough. themetfairy Nov 17 2008 10:31 AM ="SteveJRogers"]="Benjamin Grimm"] And your affection for Mariano Rivera is pretty irrational too. You have no further proof than CF/SK and other's "theories" that are asine based on the fact that they DON'T know what happened, they DON'T know what security is like in Panama, and they don't believe in blamming the kid for not checking to see if the fencing was off when he jumped in to get the rod. Fine - YOU go for a swim in his pool then. metirish Nov 17 2008 10:32 AM It was I that asked , blame the Irish if you must. Actually I never expected this kind of response , seriously , no really I didn't. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 10:35 AM Thanks, can you cop to making up quotes to generalize about the entire board when the only one using words like that was centerfield? Can you cop to spinning the incident using nebulous terms like "was involved with"? Will you admit to being wrong that nobody else anywhere has criticized him? Can you get that mirror out of my face? I don't like it. I think Manny Corpas may be more popular among Panamanians, but don't throw a mirror at me if I'm wrong. John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 17 2008 10:40 AM omg Fman99 Nov 17 2008 10:45 AM ="SteveJRogers"]="Benjamin Grimm"] And your affection for Mariano Rivera is pretty irrational too. Lets see: 1) The man is a man of God, and is essentially the Roberto Clemente of Panama. Very charitable and very much a pillar of that communtiy. Even if you disagree with his religious belief system, you have to at least admire that, and no it is not "SO HE PAINTS CHURCHES" it is about doing the work and not simply giving money to charity, it is about getting your hands dirty and doing the work. 2) Other than aforementioned incident in which I've found only people on this board feel that he is culpable for, there has been not a single sliver of controversy attached to him in any sort of either wrong doing, or him being labeled a jerk during brushes of greatness. In other words, he is one of the good guys of the game. Therefore, how is ANYONE's affection for him irrational? Wow, you sound like Dennis Hopper's character in "Apocalypse Now." Time to start cutting the pills in half Jeets. I can hate Rivera - he wears a Yankee uniform. Duh. It's not rocket science or wizardry. Go play with your Giambi dolls. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 10:46 AM ="John Cougar Lunchbucket":yuzgwi48]omg[/quote:yuzgwi48] Yeah, I know. Manny Corpas. What was I thinking? SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 10:48 AM ]Thanks, can you cop to making up quotes to generalize about the entire board when the only one using words like that was centerfield? Fine, but most of this board feels the same way as CF does. As evidence to the infamous thread between me and SK a few years back in the RLF. ]Can you cop to spinning the incident using nebulous terms like "was involved with"? No, because that is the extent of his involvement in the incident. There really isn't a smoking gun. ]Will you admit to being wrong that nobody else anywhere has criticized him? Other than blovating Yankee hating forum members? Seriously, try putting the theory on any rational board, even filled with Yankee haters, and you get looked like you wear a tin foil hat. Look, the point is that people have irrational hate for teams and players, that is the bottom line answer to Irish's original question. SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 10:49 AM ="Fman99":3b129hmh] I can hate Rivera - he wears a Yankee uniform.[/quote:3b129hmh] I wasn't referring to "sports hate," I'm talking about hating on the human being that goes beyond the uniform. Benjamin Grimm Nov 17 2008 10:51 AM This is becoming one of those threads, isn't it? Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 10:55 AM ="SteveJRogers":1lqkd4ig]Fine, but most of this board feels the same way as CF does. As evidence to the infamous thread between me and SK a few years back in the RLF.[/quote:1lqkd4ig] Nonsense. Is there something between saint and murderer? You don't know how "most of this board" feels. ="SteveJRogers":1lqkd4ig]No, because that is the extent of his involvement in the incident. There really isn't a smoking gun.[/quote:1lqkd4ig] He'd be in deeper water in the United States. Of that, I think even you are certain. ="SteveJRogers":1lqkd4ig]Other than blovating Yankee hating forum members?[/quote:1lqkd4ig] Please don't tempt me with any more name-calling. You're wrong. SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 10:59 AM ="Benjamin Grimm":2a4403r2]This is becoming one of those threads, isn't it?[/quote:2a4403r2] Me against all of you based on the fact that this group seems to be the only people who irrationally hate Mariano Rivera as a person, which I'm using as a point of people's irrational hate on sports teams and players? Yeah it does seem like it. Hell, I can't even find one person that agrees with CF's/SK's and other's theory on the former home of this forum, so what does that tell you? themetfairy Nov 17 2008 11:02 AM ="SteveJRogers":23qztokh] Hell, I can't even find one person that agrees with CF's/SK's and other's theory on the former home of this forum, so what does that tell you?[/quote:23qztokh] That nobody else around here is so obsessed that they want to go dig up ancient threads. The issue, btw, goes back to the person who was electrocuted in Rivera's pool a few years back. CF and I were pretty appalled by the incident. Steve, apparently, finds it excusable. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 11:03 AM Steve Rogers talks shit about the Crane Pool on another forum: http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=84643 SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 11:04 AM ="Edgy DC":1wmnx6qa]He'd be in deeper water in the United States. Of that, I think even you are certain. [/quote:1wmnx6qa] Security concerns are quite different here than Panama, of that I think even you are certain. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 11:05 AM Good. What's your point, Crane Pool insulting guy? SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 11:07 AM That people have irrational hate for teams and players based on a natural disposition to hate said team and players. metirish Nov 17 2008 11:09 AM ="Edgy DC":3rnp96ob]Steve Rogers talks shit about the Crane Pool on another forum: http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=84643[/quote:3rnp96ob] omg Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 11:10 AM Goodness, Steve. I challenged you to find one such statement from me. Stop with the sweeping generalizations. You're making 'em here. You're making 'em at sites that couldn't care less about us. seawolf17 Nov 17 2008 11:16 AM /throws some popcorn in the microwave /sits back and watches train wreck Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 11:17 AM Glad I could help your day along. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 11:25 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 17 2008 11:26 AM Steve tries to get support for his viewpoint at a Yankee forum --- while endorsing "hate" as long as it remains baseless --- and annoys them into closing the thread: http://forums.nyyfans.com/archive/index.php/t-97459.html Willets Point Nov 17 2008 11:25 AM ="Benjamin Grimm":10a3hs2z]This is becoming one of those threads, isn't it?[/quote:10a3hs2z] I guess I provoked this by asking where MLB is promoting David Wright as the "Face of Baseball". Three pages later, evidence of that contention is still lacking. SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 11:32 AM ="Willets Point":37j7vkjm]="Benjamin Grimm":37j7vkjm]This is becoming one of those threads, isn't it?[/quote:37j7vkjm] I guess I provoked this by asking where MLB is promoting David Wright as the "Face of Baseball". Three pages later, evidence of that contention is still lacking.[/quote:37j7vkjm] Who is on covers of MLB games? Who is the Met usually featured on TV ads and marketing tools of MLB? seawolf17 Nov 17 2008 11:34 AM ="SteveJRogers"]="Willets Point"]="Benjamin Grimm"]This is becoming one of those threads, isn't it? I guess I provoked this by asking where MLB is promoting David Wright as the "Face of Baseball". Three pages later, evidence of that contention is still lacking. Who is on covers of MLB games? Who is the Met usually featured on TV ads and marketing tools of MLB? Willets Point Nov 17 2008 11:38 AM ="SteveJRogers"]Who is on covers of MLB games? A Phillie. ="SteveJRogers"] Who is the Met usually featured on TV ads and marketing tools of MLB? That would make him the face of the Mets not MLB. Here in Boston, I'd wager most baseball fans wouldn't know who David Wright is whereas they'd be familiar with Albert Pujols or Ryan Howard or even other Mets like Delgado & Beltran. Wright is a great player but hasn't gained national attention by winning an MVP or some type of batting title or appearing in a lot of postseason games. I doubt people around the nation are gnashing their teeth about how much overexposure that Wright guy gets SteveJRogers Nov 17 2008 12:03 PM Okay fine, I'll ammend the argument to suggest that he WILL be attaining the heights of the Rose/Ripken/Jeter level of hate because his image is everywhere. And don't for a second think it won't. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 12:07 PM And then people will hate justifiably. Got it. The silly thing is, Steve, irish's position and yours seem to be similar. If you weren't so fast to choose his as a leaping off point to push your agenda against the rest of us, you'd see that. metirish Nov 17 2008 12:29 PM How is my position similar to Steve's?, Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 12:31 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 18 2008 07:27 PM Well, you seem to imply that there's an unfortuate amount of hatred flying around. Where Steve breaks from you with his his apparent belief that everybody's exercising it but him. metirish Nov 17 2008 12:33 PM Jeez thanks , lump me in with Rogers. Edgy DC Nov 17 2008 12:42 PM Not at all. It would be an unattractive lump. Centerfield Nov 17 2008 01:46 PM I called Mariano Rivera a murderer. You may direct all correspondence on that subject to me. Thanks. metsmarathon Nov 17 2008 06:25 PM wait... who hates cal ripken? i mean, fine, the holiday inn commercials are insufferable and all, but that aside, does anybody really hate him? Willets Point Nov 17 2008 06:27 PM ="metsmarathon"]wait... who hates cal ripken? i mean, fine, the holiday inn commercials are insufferable and all, but that aside, does anybody really hate him? Millions of people hate Cal Ripken. Rogers has lists of all their names! cooby Nov 17 2008 07:37 PM Hey. What does blovating mean? Fman99 Nov 17 2008 07:42 PM ="cooby":1yvq0p7i]Hey. What does blovating mean?[/quote:1yvq0p7i] I don't know. But there is a 100% chance I work it into my CPF song parody challenge play-in game. cooby Nov 17 2008 07:47 PM Fman, if you do, I promise to vote for you HahnSolo Nov 17 2008 08:04 PM ="Edgy DC":3dmxgmap]Steve tries to get support for his viewpoint at a Yankee forum --- while endorsing "hate" as long as it remains baseless --- and annoys them into closing the thread: http://forums.nyyfans.com/archive/index.php/t-97459.html[/quote:3dmxgmap] He's an equal opportunity annoyer. John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 17 2008 08:40 PM Jeezziz. Valadius Nov 17 2008 08:56 PM Steve, I don't like the fact that you bad-mouthed me on another board. Nymr83 Nov 17 2008 09:12 PM wow board-drama. and steve can't even keep it on the board. hey steve, if this place is so bad that you have to complain about it elsewhere, why are you still here? metsguyinmichigan Nov 17 2008 09:29 PM Damn, stuck in a school board meeting all day and I missed this. 1) I hate Derek Jeter. He's Mr. Yankee 2) I like David Wright. A lot. He's Mr. Met, at least the non-costumed one. 3) Mariano Rivera is a soul-less cyborg with a dangerous pool. 4) Steve needs to keeps his beefs about the 'Pool family within the 'Pool family. All caught up. metsmarathon Nov 18 2008 07:37 AM i so wish i had seen this thread earlier yesterday... i still haven't gotten an answer on what evidence there is showing cal ripken's hatedness. and i still don't know how david wright parallels derek jeter. i also would think that the whole point of this thread, initially, was to point out what i would call special hate, not just the generic 'waah i hate XXX 'cos they're our rival and they suck and blah blah blah, and i hate YYY cos he's their best player and he sucks too!' the instances stevie seems to be pulling out about fans of other teams whining over wrights accomplishments and cheering his misaccomplishments seems more like hating on, than hating. "david wright doesn't deserve to win the mvp because YYY was a muuch better player and he didnt come through when they needed him anyways" isn't hating, its hating on, or deliberately (and perhaps intellectually dishonestly) minimizing his accomplishments and value. and of course, using sound logic and reasoning in a fact-based argument against the gross overrating of a player, well, that's not hating. that's called analyzing derek jeter. and he does a terrifically poor job of relaying the conversations of this board to other boards. i mean, jeez! Benjamin Grimm Nov 18 2008 07:51 AM ="metsmarathon":3by8ybm2]and he does a terrifically poor job of relaying the conversations of this board to other boards. i mean, jeez![/quote:3by8ybm2] Is that at all surprising? It's amazing how tenaciously he's held on to this issue, even going to other boards to try to get validation for his point of view. It's appropriate that his link back to us contained the phrase "getalifealready" Centerfield Nov 18 2008 07:56 AM For the record, I have no problem with him talking badly about us on other boards. In fact, I wish he would post on those other boards more often. Like all the time. Steve, don't go away mad... themetfairy Nov 18 2008 08:47 AM There was also the great leap of logic (if you can call it that) that Steve made. He asked, "How can you not like Mario Rivera?" I answered that I found the electrified pool to be a reason not to like him. He then extrapolated that I was blinded by irrational hatred, and posted about my obsessiveness all over the Internet. Yeah, I was the obsessed one here.... G-Fafif Nov 18 2008 09:10 AM I have to confess I barely remember the Mariano Rivera pool story and don't remember, at all, the conversation here about it. That said, fuck Mariano Rivera and fuck the Yankees. I mean, geez... soupcan Nov 18 2008 09:19 AM I didn't get much of a chance to get here yesterday and read most of this thread on my BlackBerry on the train home. "It's gold Jerry, pure gold!" Seriously, I was cracking up all the way home. Edgy DC Nov 18 2008 10:03 AM I keep Metro North moving. Kong76 Nov 18 2008 07:21 PM SJR: I'm clarifing it for you by holding up a fucking mirror <=== EDC: Don't fucking mirror me. <===

Met hate is mostly leftover stuff from the mid-80s or it's about being anti-NYC. And, either way, the specific reasons given for up-to-date hate; Reyes dancing, Wright's image, etc. are generally nothing more than rationalizations after the fact rather than actual reasons. IOW, once folks decide they dislike something it's easy to find specifics to justify it.

On the trade front, the scribes have a bit of disagreement on the status of ChiSox closer Bobby Jenks. The Post's Sherman declares it a virtually still-born idea citing too high an asking price (Fartinez + ?) combined with questions about decreasing K-rates and whether the Sox are making him available in the first place because they know something about him that other teams will only find out the hard way. Newsday's Davidoff, on the other hand, suggests a trade is in some ways preferable to the FA route and includes insider-ish quotes on how those plummeting K-rates are really signs of Jenks becoming a more complete pitcher. I do know Jenks had a real ass-hat rep early in his career. He came out of some trailer-park/white-trash kind of background complete with the requisite drinking problem which was at least part of what led to his release from the Angels org while still a minor-leaguer despite his ability to hit triple-digits on the radar gun. He of course then went on to anchor the Sox pen in their '05 run to the WS and I haven't heard about any problems since so maybe all that nonsense is behind him.

Hoffman's numbers this season weren't as bad as I thought. Only 45 innings worth (missed some time due to injury) but a real good WHiP and his K/BB and H/IP ratios suggest he deserved a better ERA than the 3.7 he put up. On the other hand he just turned 41, had a real good pitchers park to call home, and a fastball/changeup pitcher with a diminshing fastball kinda scares you. And then there's some interesting stuff in Joel Sherman's NYPost column today - enough to suggest that they're not just going to throw money at the problem and hope for the best. There is growing belief in the industry, in fact, that Rodriguez will have to retreat from his five-year, $75 million demands and accept four years. Yet, the Mets still might prefer Fuentes. K-Rod did set the season record with 62 saves in 2008. But one Mets official had this insight: "When it comes to statistics, we are not basing this decision on save totals; at least not save totals alone." The Mets will honor, among other items, strikeout-to-walk ratio and on-base percentage against. And I came across this stat just out of curiosity: Rodriguez registered 1-2-3 frames in a career-low 29.2 percent of his innings (all figures courtesy of Elias). That ranked 151st out of 253 pitchers who worked at least 60 innings in 2008. Fuentes (41.3) was 13th, Wood (38.1) was 28th, Street (38.0), even with diminished stuff, was 29th, and another free agent, Brandon Lyon (37.7) was 31st. Rodriguez's stuff is not as electric as in the past, possibly because his high-effort delivery has robbed some life from his arm, though he is just 26. The Mets could wonder if the lack of clean 1-2-3 innings will continue to grow with age now, and if Rodriguez loses more stuff, will he be able to extract himself from difficulty with the same excellence?

Newsday's Ken Davidoff is on the radio RIGHT NOW saying the same thing. He thinks some team(s) will at least come close to the reported Yanx offer and that the final price tag will likely go higher before things are all over.

The alternative being that when you need a lot it may be smarter to forgo the one big piece in favor of 3 or 4 lesser pieces for the same price.

]Let's not forget that it was the Mets bullpen that undermined the team more than anything else over the past two seasons. K-Rod might be a drastic remedy to some, but the bullpen needs help drastically Sure, just keep in mind that Rodriguez replacing Wagner essentially just gets you back to where you were!! One guy doesn't make your bullpen solid anymore than getting one speedster makes you a running team.

Non-F Rodriguez options and possible prices (acc to Ken Davidoff - Newsday). He projects FRod @ 4 years for $54mil Brian Fuentes: 3 years, $38mil Kerry Wood: 2 x $10 Trevor Hoffman: 1 x $7 not really closers Joe Beimel: 3 x $3 Juan Cruz: 3 x $5 Russ Springer: 1 x $4 CH Park: 1 x $3.5 Or trade options: Huston Street - Now with Colorado Bobby Jenks - ChiSox

Rodriguez will likely be fine. He's been good, he's still young, yadda yadda. The problem comes from the fact that buying a closer on the open market is a very inefficient way of making your leads "safe", and from the usual 'GiGs' notion common among fans that evryone else's closer is better than the one we have. FR threw 203 innings over the last 3 seasons, Wagner 188. IOW they were used about the same once you account for Wag's truncated 2008. So let's boil those last 3 down to an "average" 70 inning season: ---HERBBKHRWHiPERASave PctK-Rod5218329041.202.3189.8%Wagner5419208461.062.4085.6% Not a whole lotta difference, eh? Fewer HRs but more walks. More baserunners yet no more runs and fewer blown saves as a pct of the whole (although saves, like RBIs, are largely a product of opportunity and I suspect the Angels "small ball" style has led to more games to save than usual). And for that "gain" you're probably paying about half again as much as Wagner ($40mil for 4 years becomes something like $60) while hoping that his age makes it safer and that the somewhat declining peripherals aren't a sign of bad things to come.

="seawolf17"]Let's offer him bonuses based on his hitting. I guess an extra clause in his contract would be known as a C.C. rider. Thank you, I'll be here all week ... don't forget to tip your waitresses

Player1st2nd3rdPointsLee2440132Halladay415571F. Rodriguez071132Matsuzaka02410M. Rivera0033Mussina0022 E. Santana0022

Swisher to the Yanx!!! for minor league pitcher Jeff Marquez (and maybe others) Guess he's depth at 1B, corner OF, or maybe CF -- although they might find it a mistake if they think he's a full-time CF or a bit light-hitting if they think he's a full-time 1B

="Nymr83":340zi3t0]="Benjamin Grimm":340zi3t0]Dale Sveum got a vote? For managing 13 games?[/quote:340zi3t0] Palmiero. Gold Glove. These guys just shouldn't have ballots.[/quote:340zi3t0] Except that gold gloves are a coaches & managers ballot. Can't blame the writers for those. Edgy DC Nov 13 2008 01:21 PM Don't knock him off that high horse. It's a long way down. soupcan Nov 13 2008 01:59 PM Oh, snap.