TransMonk

I had to leave the house early last night, but caught the first inning and the Delgado HR. I thought with a 3 run lead against Peavy we would be set. Thoroughly disappointing to see later that they lost by a run.

Perez 4 Delgado 2 Beltran 1 Reyes 1 Parnell 1 Putz 1

Ollie looks slightly better today. We need some runs...I'm actually going against everything that brain is telling me and am rooting hard for Sheff to do well.

FWIW, Church makes a great lefthanded bat off the bench.

Is it to early to start questioning Jerry? One of the things I really liked about him last year is that he was anti-Willie as far as playing the "hot hand" and FWIW the Mets won a bunch of games last season while he was doing it. This season he has been annoying, if not questionable, in his mathcing up of lefty vs. righty with the bullpen. And now this Sheffield start...why? Sheffield's starting lineup debut should wait for a game against a lefty pitcher, preferably not after an off day and not when Church has been hitting consistently at the plate. This makes no sense to me. I wonder if this has anything to do with the looming #500? I doubt it, but him getting the start tonight blows my mind.

="batmagadanleadoff":1rehx0sb]C'mon. Get serious. You're taking this too seriously. [/quote:1rehx0sb] Out of context, this makes me laugh out loud. John Cougar Lunchbucket Apr 15 2009 12:16 PM ="Gwreck"] That's the image I'll dig out for the game tonight if this Chick Corea guy no hits us for 4 innings Edgy DC Apr 15 2009 12:18 PM ="batmagadanleadoff":2pzqyafl]="Edgy DC":2pzqyafl]Then please don't insult people by playing cards you know are nonsense. Believe what you want, but please, at least, be honest.[/quote:2pzqyafl] Insult people? C'mon. Get serious. You're taking this too seriously.[/quote:2pzqyafl] No, honesty isn't too much to ask. ="batmagadanleadoff":2pzqyafl]I don't have to like this Jackie Robinson Rotunda business just because you do.[/quote:2pzqyafl] As I said, "Believe what you want, but please, at least, be honest." And it has nothing to do with what I like. Except perhaps that I'd like this forum not to be papered with nonsense, which you acknowledge as such, but nonetheless advances your agenda. I'm even the one who opened up the subject of Jackie Robinson Day, and the overkill of too many uniform tributes, so it's not like I don't get it. ="batmagadanleadoff":2pzqyafl]And besides, although the UCLA reference might be superfluous to my POV, it might not be to someone else. At UCLA, Jackie represented himself with the same level of class and achievement that he would later exhibit as a Dodger.[/quote:2pzqyafl] Give me a break. It may be bait to draw people away from any real issue, but it's nonetheless relevant if people bite? LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Apr 15 2009 12:19 PM ="TransMonk":1zk7jiuj]="batmagadanleadoff":1zk7jiuj]C'mon. Get serious. You're taking this too seriously. [/quote:1zk7jiuj] Out of context, this makes me laugh out loud.[/quote:1zk7jiuj] I'm glad I'm not the only one. (Apropos of nothing, I snarfed my soda.) And hell, batmags, if you like the rotunda, just think of it as the Just Plain Rotunda, and pretend the "42" is a Douglas Adams tribute. Edgy DC Apr 15 2009 12:20 PM I apologize for my huge part of this shit. metirish Apr 15 2009 12:21 PM Isn't Chick Corea a singer, I hope he's off key tonight. metirish Apr 15 2009 12:22 PM I apologize for bringing it up , it was nothing more really than a smart ass comment. G-Fafif Apr 15 2009 12:31 PM I like the Rotunda, but I'd like a lot more[/url:3q9n3phx]. G-Fafif Apr 15 2009 01:16 PM Fresh from the Rotunda dedication, Davidoff reports the owner of the Mets plans a Mets HOF. ]Fred Wilpon said the the team is planning on establishing a Mets Hall of Fame, most likely in the centerfield concourse with the high-end food selections and the old Home Run Apple. Also, you'll be thrilled to know, Davidoff learned the Mets got the Red Sox' OK to blast Neil Diamond at the grateful throngs. ]The Mets went so far as to get a blessing from Red Sox ownership before renewing their usage of "Sweet Caroline" as the "eighth-inning song" at Citi Field; the Neil Diamond song has long been a Fenway Park staple. But the fans' massive boos told the whole story. The Mets need to find their own song. They considered Coldplay's "Viva la Vida," which they used during their pre-game introductions Monday night, but decided against it. Remember when the only thing we asked the Red Sox' permission for was when we could borrow their champagne? John Cougar Lunchbucket Apr 15 2009 01:23 PM Let's go with Chick Corea's "Now He Sings, Now He Sobs" Listen to this guy play the pianny. Just gorgeous and then, he stretches it out. Benjamin Grimm Apr 15 2009 01:26 PM I think the Mets Hall of Fame should be located in Dodger Stadium. batmagadanleadoff Apr 15 2009 01:32 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Apr 15 2009 02:30 PM ="Edgy DC":1aroddf7]="batmagadanleadoff":1aroddf7]="Edgy DC":1aroddf7]Then please don't insult people by playing cards you know are nonsense. Believe what you want, but please, at least, be honest.[/quote:1aroddf7] Insult people? C'mon. Get serious. You're taking this too seriously.[/quote:1aroddf7] No, honesty isn't too much to ask. ="batmagadanleadoff":1aroddf7]I don't have to like this Jackie Robinson Rotunda business just because you do.[/quote:1aroddf7] As I said, "Believe what you want, but please, at least, be honest." And it has nothing to do with what I like. Except perhaps that I'd like this forum not to be papered with nonsense, which you acknowledge as such, but nonetheless advances your agenda. I'm even the one who opened up the subject of Jackie Robinson Day, and the overkill of too many uniform tributes, so it's not like I don't get it. ="batmagadanleadoff":1aroddf7]And besides, although the UCLA reference might be superfluous to my POV, it might not be to someone else. At UCLA, Jackie represented himself with the same level of class and achievement that he would later exhibit as a Dodger.[/quote:1aroddf7] Give me a break. It may be bait to draw people away from any real issue, but it's nonetheless relevant if people bite?[/quote:1aroddf7] There's not one single dishonest bone in my UCLA reference. It's highly likely, and thus reasonable to assume, that if this Jackie Robinson Rotunda was in Chavez-Ravine, connected to Dodger Stadium -- where it belongs, I believe -- there'd be UCLA references in the Dodgers tribute. The UCLA reference is superfluous to my opinion, not only because it wouldn't change my view, as I already stated, but also, because I wasn't editorializing for the Dodgers to build their own JR Rotunda. Frankly, I could care less what the Dodgers do. I merely opined that the Mets shouldn't honor an opponent -- not that the Dodgers should honor their own. And on that basis, my opinion is just as valid with or without the Bruin nod. I suppose that this is my old-school sensibilies surfacing -- where a baseball player in any uniform other than a Met uniform, is the enemy, and that I'd plunk JR just as easy as I might plunk Tommie Agee in a meaningless Spring Training game if they were opponents and I thought that the situation called for a plunking. I fully realize that here, you might note that JR's contributions transcended the game itself; that there is a larger point to be made by honoring JR with an eponymous Rotunda at Citi, and that the daily battles between two baseball teams are nothing more than tiny points of paint in the grand masterpiece that was JR's life. And you'd be right. Just as right as Grimm was when he noted that JR belongs to NY baseball fans as much as he belongs to anybody else. There's no right answer here, other than that Wilpon owns the Mets and he can do as he wishes. And because there's no right answer here, this discussion won't resolve itself as neatly and as irrefutably as a mathematical proof. But my POV is just as valid as yours is. Edgy DC Apr 15 2009 01:51 PM I never said it wasn't. Ashie62 Apr 15 2009 05:34 PM ="Benjamin Grimm":2zuig4gl]I think the Mets Hall of Fame should be located in Dodger Stadium.[/quote:2zuig4gl] It sure fells that way..Makes me pine for Shea all the more Kong76 Apr 15 2009 06:56 PM This list on a certain site needs some major work after tonight ... Larry Elliot Ron Taylor Chuck Taylor Hank Webb Ron Hodges Tom Hall Ron Hodges Roger McDowell Butch Huskey Mo Vaughn G-Fafif Apr 16 2009 07:22 AM Tim Smith, in the Snooze, praises the Rotunda, says in essence that no, you can't have both the Jackie salute and Mets history. You get the former, stop complaining about the latter, you small-minded Mets fans. Jeff Wilpon is Viva Las Vague herein. (How do you build a new ballpark and decide "no room for busts," and I hope he means Luis Castillo.) ]Mets and Citi Field do right by saying, 'and here's to you Mr. Robinson' The day after the Mets christened Citi Field their fans decried the lack of team history in the $850 million ballpark. It had a sterile corporate feel, they said. Where was the homage to World Series victories? Where were the tributes to past Met greats? All those complaints rang hollow Wednesday as the team dedicated the Jackie Robinson Rotunda on the day that Robinson broke Major League Baseball's color barrier 62 years ago. The rotunda is a replica of the one at Ebbets Field, where Robinson played for the Dodgers, and is four times as big. Rachel Robinson, Jackie's widow, said she didn't spend a lot of time at the Ebbets Field rotunda. It wasn't the time or place where they would hold a meet-and-greet for the Robinsons. She would go right to her seat, where she heard the worst the fans could verbally hurl at her husband. Walking into the Jackie Robinson Rotunda Wednesday afternoon was a near religious experience for Mrs. Robinson. "It's kind of a spiritual thing," she said. "It's like being at St. John's Cathedral in Rome. I was so moved. I don't think everybody will feel that way." Certainly not those short-sighted fans who want monuments to past Mets glory in place pronto. The Mets are to be commended for conceiving and constructing the Jackie Robinson Rotunda, which extols the nine virtues that Robinson lived by: Justice, teamwork, determination, persistence, courage, excellence, citizenship, commitment and integrity. In the modern game, as in much of modern life, those virtues seem outdated. Director Spike Lee, who attended the dedication ceremony, said Robinson's legacy remains as significant today as it did when he stepped onto Ebbets Field 62 years ago, enduring the crushing social pressure and still succeeding. "Jackie and Branch Rickey knew if they were not successful in this so-called race experiment that this would set African-Americans back 10-15 years no matter what field we're talking about," Lee said. "We're talking about in all fields - science, politics, not just sports." It is hard for modern-day players to even imagine what Robinson endured to play baseball. "I can't believe he went through that kind of stuff (racists taunts)," said Jose Reyes. "It's just crazy to me. But it just shows how strong he was in mind to go through it and still play." Reyes said he has not visited the rotunda yet, but he said he has always drawn inspiration from Robinson. "Just to see the way that he played the game, the fact that he never gave up and he was always working hard," Reyes said. "He showed that you can never hang your head, and that you have to be strong every day." Fred Wilpon, the Mets chairman and CEO, was 16 when he played a game at Ebbets Field, and those nine virtues that Robinson espoused were alive inside the clubhouse. The Mets are the closest touchstone to Jackie Robinson (the National League replacement in New York for the departed Dodgers and Giants), so Wilpon knew he wanted to honor Robinson when they decided to build a new ballpark, particularly if the new place would include elements of Ebbets Field. Jeff Wilpon, the Mets' COO, said Mets fans who desire a more grand tribute to former Mets greats will get their wish soon. "We have some banners that will go up. We have some plaques that will go up," Jeff Wilpon said. "We have some retired numbers. We don't have room to do busts like we did before, but we're going to do some Hall of Fame plaques. We have some other things that we're going to do." Fred Wilpon said the Jackie Robinson Rotunda doesn't trump anything that the Mets will do in the future to honor their own history, but he believes the rotunda is a significant symbol in its own right. He's absolutely correct. By displaying the virtues on the walls and floor of the rotunda, baseball fans who enter Citi Field will at least be reminded that Robinson lived by them, and by smashing Major League Baseball's color barrier, he forced the sport, and America, to live by them as well. Baseball isn't such a virtuous place right now. It is still trying to come to grips with the blight of steroids and the taint of street agents and scouts skimming the signing bonuses of some Dominican players. And for the first time since 1995, there was an increase (2%) in the number of African-American players on major league rosters this season, according to a report released yesterday by Richard Lapchick, director of the University of Central Florida's Institute for Diversity and Ethics in Sports. "I feel encouraged. It's not a huge leap, but a step forward," said Rachel Robinson. "We have to feel encouraged, also inspired by the progress." The Mets have an African-American manager, Jerry Manuel, and just one African-American player, Gary Sheffield, who was starting his first game in right field Wednesday night and was looking for his 500th home run. The Mets don't yet have an homage to their history as grand and glorious as the Yankees in their new home. But they have done them one better by creating a permanent monument to the legacy of Jackie Robinson. "By doing this, the permanence of this, this is not a traveling exhibition at a museum, this is a welcoming mat that he should have had back in the day when he came into baseball," said Jeff Wilpon. metirish Apr 16 2009 07:25 AM Jeff seems very enthusiastic about this. I can't wait to see the results. John Cougar Lunchbucket Apr 16 2009 07:40 AM Jeff is a complete tool. I can;t be the only one who gets that impression. I sorta see him as a Vince McMahon type. metirish Apr 16 2009 07:44 AM ="John Cougar Lunchbucket":tzgvm407]Jeff is a complete tool. I can;t be the only one who gets that impression. I sorta see him as a Vince McMahon type.[/quote:tzgvm407] Oh I'm with you , I was being sarcastic....you know he has season tickets in the Pepsi Porch , it reminds him of Tiger Stadium..... Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 07:45 AM ="G-Fafif":9s02mgja]Rachel Robinson, Jackie's widow, said she didn't spend a lot of time at the Ebbets Field rotunda. It wasn't the time or place where they would hold a meet-and-greet for the Robinsons. She would go right to her seat, where she heard the worst the fans could verbally hurl at her husband.[/quote:9s02mgja] Was Robinson regularly abused with "the worst" at Ebbets field? G-Fafif Apr 16 2009 07:53 AM ="Edgy DC":uaz5b2d8]="G-Fafif":uaz5b2d8]Rachel Robinson, Jackie's widow, said she didn't spend a lot of time at the Ebbets Field rotunda. It wasn't the time or place where they would hold a meet-and-greet for the Robinsons. She would go right to her seat, where she heard the worst the fans could verbally hurl at her husband.[/quote:uaz5b2d8] Was Robinson regularly abused with "the worst" at Ebbets field?[/quote:uaz5b2d8] When did Ebbets Field move to Cincinnati, St. Louis and Philadelphia? Benjamin Grimm Apr 16 2009 07:57 AM Well, if it could move to Queens... Frayed Knot Apr 16 2009 08:05 AM ] ... we don't have room to do busts like we did before Because lord knows how much room those things take up. Benjamin Grimm Apr 16 2009 08:08 AM So what's happening to the busts? Is MeiGray selling them? Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 08:10 AM I'm planning another night raid. batmagadanleadoff Apr 16 2009 08:21 AM ="Frayed Knot"]] ... we don't have room to do busts like we did before Because lord knows how much room those things take up. I thought that quote was disturbing, myself. If there's no room for busts, then there can't be much room for a Mets HOF done right. It's Hot dogs over History. Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 08:27 AM How about here: HahnSolo Apr 16 2009 08:27 AM What makes being a Met fan who wants honors, monuments, and tributes to his team in their stadium "short-sighted"? HahnSolo Apr 16 2009 08:29 AM Those busts at Shea fit into a display that was smaller than your average walk-in closet. batmagadanleadoff Apr 16 2009 08:31 AM ="Benjamin Grimm":3fm5ql4w]Yes, the Giants and Dodgers are in California now, but Mel Ott, Christy Mathewson, John McGraw, Bill Terry, Pee Wee Reese, Jackie Robinson, Wilbert Robinson, Zach Wheat and all those other guys still belong to New York.[/quote:3fm5ql4w] One of the flaws in this otherwise valid point is that the NY Giant fans probably hated the B'klyn Dodgers -- even more than we might hate the MFY's, given that the old NY rivals played each other 18 times a season. Ironically, if not fittingly, I seem to be in the minority on this one, though. HahnSolo Apr 16 2009 08:31 AM ="Edgy DC":3kwmr6o7]How about here: [/quote:3kwmr6o7] Are the throngs so large at Touch that they need the blue rope to keep people in line? Well, at least the cord is blue. batmagadanleadoff Apr 16 2009 08:34 AM ="HahnSolo":3dt3qv7d]Those busts at Shea fit into a display that was smaller than your average walk-in closet.[/quote:3dt3qv7d] They probably don't want to "waste" the real estate on something that won't generate additional income. Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 08:38 AM ="HahnSolo":2hnipag0]="Edgy DC":2hnipag0]How about here: [/quote:2hnipag0] Are the throngs so large at Touch that they need the blue rope to keep people in line? Well, at least the cord is blue.[/quote:2hnipag0] I like how Alyssa's target audience --- dyed hair, perm, tight jeans --- is walking by without turning her head, while dorkus from New Yorkus in his backward cap/ski-cap/yarmulke is wandering in to check out the insignia thongs. Hopefully, the boutique won't last the season. seawolf17 Apr 16 2009 08:51 AM "WE DON'T HAVE ROOM FOR THE BUSTS?!?!??" Are you effing kidding me, Jeff? Screw you! You built a whole goddam building and you can't find room to honor your own Hall of Fame busts? No wonder Wally Matthews hates this team. ="HahnSolo":3ngiw1aa]What makes being a Met fan who wants honors, monuments, and tributes to his team in their stadium "short-sighted"?[/quote:3ngiw1aa] Exactly! God, I hate this shit. metirish Apr 16 2009 08:57 AM " We do have room for one bust " Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 09:09 AM This is a work in progress, and Jeff has shown himself to be a reactive manager. Why don't we give him something to react to? G-Fafif Apr 16 2009 10:19 AM Sometimes I'm surprised they had room for the actual Mets. MFS62 Apr 16 2009 10:39 AM ="G-Fafif":3129gw3s]Sometimes I'm surprised they had room for the actual Mets.[/quote:3129gw3s] As long as they were all a different height. Later Frayed Knot Apr 16 2009 10:39 AM ]Are the throngs so large at Touch that they need the blue rope to keep people in line? OK who (besides me) read that as thongs so large that they need the blue rope ... ? metsguyinmichigan Apr 16 2009 11:47 AM This might get me in a little trouble, and maybe I'm the only one. But to be totally honest, I didn't like the busts. Didn't like the style. And I wonder if creating a bust like that was expensive and difficult, and slowed down the number of inductions. And I didn't like that it wasn't readily accessible to a lot of fans. And the writing on the display cases was ugly. I love the idea of a hall of fame, and think there absolutely needs to be one. Cleveland and Philly both have neat areas in centerfield with the kind of plaques that I imagine Jeff is talking about. Lots of people walk through the area, and each plaque tells why the person on it is important. The Mets have a chance here to start from scratch, and if they come up with something like Cleveland's Heritage Park, [url:3o4t75mg]http://cleveland.indians.mlb.com/cle/ballpark/heritage_park.jsp[/url:3o4t75mg] then I'm OK with that. Ideally, they've have something like the Reds have in Cincy, which is just amazing. But I don't think any other team has done that well. seawolf17 Apr 16 2009 11:56 AM Word on the street is that YSIII has a wall of autographed baseballs from as many living MFYs as they could find. I think that's a phenomenal idea, and I wish the Mets had thought of it first. Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 12:25 PM ="metsguyinmichigan":1l6s2tnk]Didn't like the style. And I wonder if creating a bust like that was expensive and difficult, and slowed down the number of inductions.[/quote:1l6s2tnk] I suspect managerial indifference slowed it down, but benign neglect has perhaps been better than misguided engagement. My main HoF problem was that, in the post-doubleheader era, ceremonies have occurred before game time with the seats scarcely populated. I distinctly remembered being embarassed by the paucity of audience for Jerry Koosman's induction, which may have been Rube Walker's last time on the field. G-Fafif Apr 16 2009 01:04 PM ="seawolf17":2pflv7ph]Word on the street is that YSIII has a wall of autographed baseballs from as many living MFYs as they could find. I think that's a phenomenal idea, and I wish the Mets had thought of it first.[/quote:2pflv7ph] Saw it on the YEECH pregame show and, yeah, it's a brilliant idea beautifully executed. They're even summoning family members and whoever they can find to rustle up balls for the departed MFYs. On the other hand, the Mets would appreciate it if you'd stop thinking about Brian Ostrosser while enjoying your world-class Citi Field experience. G-Fafif Apr 16 2009 01:07 PM ="metsguyinmichigan":224d4oqf]This might get me in a little trouble, and maybe I'm the only one. But to be totally honest, I didn't like the busts. The Mets have a chance here to start from scratch, and if they come up with something like Cleveland's Heritage Park, then I'm OK with that. [...] Ideally, they've have something like the Reds have in Cincy, which is just amazing. But I don't think any other team has done that well.[/quote:224d4oqf] I never thought the busts were optimal, but if you've got 'em, flaunt 'em. I love that, as you pointed out, Cleon the elder is portrayed whereas all the other Famers are in their prime. I like trying to figure out why; I don't necessarily need to know. Add the Baltimore museum, opened a few years ago next to Camden Yards, as something to be studied by the Mets and attended by anybody in the neighborhood. G-Fafif Apr 16 2009 01:09 PM ="Edgy DC":1s2trfoy]My main HoF problem was that, in the post-doubleheader era, ceremonies have occurred before game time with the seats scarcely populated. I distinctly remembered being embarassed by the paucity of audience for Jerry Koosman's induction, which may have been Rube Walker's last time on the field.[/quote:1s2trfoy] Since 2000, whenever they do a big event, like '06 reunion or All-Amazin' Team or Ralph Night, they move it back to the start time on the ticket. That way people are indeed in their seats. They didn't do it in '02 for Agee's induction and it was a little depressing. You might recall Seaver criticized Valentine mightily for not having his team in the dugout (they were having a meeting that saved their season, thus that 2002 pennant that flies high and proud over Citi Field). Seaver was correct. Centerfield Apr 16 2009 01:34 PM Jackie Robinson played for the Brooklyn Dodgers. They are the only team for which a tribute to Jackie would be a perfect fit. Unfortunately, that team doesn't exist anymore. It sucks, but it's reality. Sometimes there are no good answers. The Los Angeles Dodgers and the New York Mets are probably the best options left. Arguments can be given for each team, but for every argument, there is a valid argument against. If I had to choose one of the two, I'd probably say the Dodgers are more appropriate. But I don't feel strongly one way or the other. Which brings us to the rotunda. Does it make sense to have a Jackie Robinson tribute be the signature of the Mets new home stadium? And the answer, in my opinion, is no. Whether or not the Dodgers are a more appropriate team, a featuring a Brooklyn Dodger as the centerpiece of the new home of the New York Mets is, at best, awkward. Centerfield Apr 16 2009 01:37 PM ="HahnSolo":3e4tnjsm]Those busts at Shea fit into a display that was smaller than your average walk-in closet.[/quote:3e4tnjsm] Maybe that's the problem. I like bigger busts. Benjamin Grimm Apr 16 2009 01:43 PM Would it make more sense for a statue of Connie Mack to be in Philadelphia or Oakland? Should Walter Johnson be honored in Washington, or in Minneapolis? My votes would go to Philadelphia and Washington. So I think it's more appropriate to honor Jackie Robinson in New York than in Los Angeles. But I think the big rotunda at the Mets ballpark is a bit much. Were it up to me, Citi Field would not look like Ebbets Field. It wouldn't be retro at all. And there would be a nice big memorial to Jackie Robinson in Brooklyn somewhere. Maybe somewhere near the anchorage of the Brooklyn Bridge, so that people could walk there from Manhattan. Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 01:48 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Apr 16 2009 04:33 PM What should be noted as part of the rotunda display is that --- as good as he was at baseball, football, and track --- his best sport might have been underwear basketball. Thinking back to my days in Joe Ellner's basement, that might have been my best sport also. Swan Swan H Apr 16 2009 01:52 PM Michael Jordan's Hanes ads are clearly a tribute to Jackie Robinson's underwear basketball career. Frayed Knot Apr 16 2009 01:53 PM ="Centerfield"]Maybe that's the problem. I like bigger busts. ... and he can not lie. ]Thinking back to my days in Joe Ellner's basement, [underwear basketball] might have been my best sport also. TMI Fman99 Apr 16 2009 04:04 PM Who farted? Fman99 Apr 16 2009 04:06 PM ="G-Fafif":1e8206y9]="metsguyinmichigan":1e8206y9]This might get me in a little trouble, and maybe I'm the only one. But to be totally honest, I didn't like the busts. The Mets have a chance here to start from scratch, and if they come up with something like Cleveland's Heritage Park, then I'm OK with that. [...] Ideally, they've have something like the Reds have in Cincy, which is just amazing. But I don't think any other team has done that well.[/quote:1e8206y9] I never thought the busts were optimal, but if you've got 'em, flaunt 'em. I love that, as you pointed out, Cleon the elder is portrayed whereas all the other Famers are in their prime. I like trying to figure out why; I don't necessarily need to know. Add the Baltimore museum, opened a few years ago next to Camden Yards, as something to be studied by the Mets and attended by anybody in the neighborhood.[/quote:1e8206y9] I am a big fan of busts. HahnSolo Apr 17 2009 06:56 AM After my first trip to Citi and the rotunda, my feelings have somewhat changed. I was never a big fan of the entire rotunda being dedicated to Jackie. however, having seen it up close, it is done in a quite classy way, and it is completely un-intrusive. You are not clubbed over the head with Jackie, Jackie, Jackie. It's there, yes, and it is prominent, but you can just as easily avoid it. seawolf17 Apr 17 2009 08:42 AM I love fman. He's added a dynamic to the Pool that can't be quantified. He's our own Cap'n Intangibles. themetfairy Apr 17 2009 09:17 AM ="seawolf17":38irfm09]I love fman. He's added a dynamic to the Pool that can't be quantified. He's our own Cap'n Intangibles.[/quote:38irfm09] But way less slimy than the MFY's version. seawolf17 Apr 17 2009 11:46 AM Have you met him? Don't count out his sliminess. We did a lot of weird things in the basement of the Blake B Building. PiggiesTomatoes Apr 17 2009 04:53 PM ="seawolf17"]We did a lot of weird things in the basement of the Blake B Building. A Geneseo guy? cooby Apr 17 2009 09:48 PM Funny, all of it. Kong76 Apr 17 2009 09:52 PM FK: OK who (besides me) read that as thongs so large that they need the blue rope ... ? <<< I thought it was a typo too. G-Fafif Apr 17 2009 10:10 PM It never stops amusing me that Fman proclaims his love of big busts and his avatar is of that little angel. MFS62 Apr 18 2009 06:56 AM ="G-Fafif":3jk8wpwh]It never stops amusing me that Fman proclaims his love of big busts and his avatar is of that little angel.[/quote:3jk8wpwh] Don't start getting all sweet on us when this thread was going in an entirely different direction. Later

I still love this trade. Milledge patroling the outfield at Citi would give me more nightmares than Murphy.

All of the above. We've already lost as many games to outfield defense blunders than I thought we would all season. I'd leave Church in at least until there is more info on how the new field is going to play. Obviously, Sheff is going to get some starts...but it shouldn't be after an off day with Ollie on the mound.

After further review, it looks like Piazza is not coming in from behind. The uni numbers are on the right arm, and it look to me like the guy rolling around with Piazza is number 10...which would make him Dave Hollins. Dave was the hitting coach for Binghamton in 2005.

It's an Angels interleauge game from July 2, 1997. Dodgers 5, Angels 4 http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/ANA/ANA199707020.shtml http://www.sportslogos.net/logo.php?id=4917 http://www.avalanchejournal.com/stories/061402/pro_061402082.shtml

No doubter, even at Citi!

Edgy DC wrote: Well, then you might want to take a piss break when Adrian Gonzalez comes to the plate. Bullet of cool!

METS!!!

Legendary voice of both baseball and football. RIP

Kind of right. If I was Santana, I'd be pissed and probably would have been much harsher. Obvoiusly, Murph is accepting responsibility for the gaffe, which is right as well.

Looks like a folded Bobby V.

Star Jones used to be on Inside Edition. Geraldo Rivera has an investigative journalist background. Everyone you see on cable news has an agenda whether it is hidden or not. I had always thought you understood this. Bill O'Reilly tailors his facts to support an agenda and/or increase his ratings. Either way, he is an entertainer and not a journalist. Just like Olbermann and Francesa.

WOW, Steve. I'm blown away by that comment. For someone who has posted many posts on the evils of how "the media" dupes the general public into believing one thing or another, you certainly seem to be drinking the O'Reilly koolaid. I don't need to be spoon fed opinion by talking heads. I'll check in every once in a while to see how much bullshit they are attempting to shovel. I've heard enough of O'Reilly to form my personal opinion that he is a moron and no more informative than a bag of hair. Weak.

="SteveJRogers":3cgd8jcz]I'd respect O'Reilly as an authority on the things he speaks about...[/quote:3cgd8jcz] Someone who respects what any of these blowhards (Francesa, O'Reilly, Olbermann) say as an authority on anything other than entertainment and shock value needs to re-evaluate their views on reality. SteveJRogers Apr 13 2009 09:24 AM ="TransMonk":323a1z3p] Someone who respects what any of these blowhards (Francesa, O'Reilly, Olbermann) say as an authority on anything other than entertainment and shock value needs to re-evaluate their views on reality.[/quote:323a1z3p] O'Reilly is more of a reporter than Francesa (actually he has been getting better since loosing the Dog) and Olbermann ever were. Maybe you should watch instead of getting your info from haters on message boards and whatnot. batmagadanleadoff Apr 13 2009 09:33 AM I'm a fanatical Met fan and I never, ever, ever listen to Mike Francesca. G-Fafif Apr 13 2009 09:35 AM ="batmagadanleadoff":1ex6emip]I'm a fanatical Met fan and I never, ever, ever listen to Mike Francesca.[/quote:1ex6emip] But you shave with Gillette Foamy. TransMonk Apr 13 2009 09:35 AM WOW, Steve. I'm blown away by that comment. For someone who has posted many posts on the evils of how "the media" dupes the general public into believing one thing or another, you certainly seem to be drinking the O'Reilly koolaid. I don't need to be spoon fed opinion by talking heads. I'll check in every once in a while to see how much bullshit they are attempting to shovel. I've heard enough of O'Reilly to form my personal opinion that he is a moron and no more informative than a bag of hair. Weak. batmagadanleadoff Apr 13 2009 09:37 AM ="G-Fafif":130o63x3]="batmagadanleadoff":130o63x3]I'm a fanatical Met fan and I never, ever, ever listen to Mike Francesca.[/quote:130o63x3] But you shave with Gillette Foamy.[/quote:130o63x3] I was going to get around to quizzing the forum on who the partial head (lower right avatar) belongs to. Any ideas? G-Fafif Apr 13 2009 09:40 AM Francesa by himself is not all powerful. It is that we invest his views or words with our anger/annoyance that makes him a bigger deal than he is. So for five hours a day he is presumptuous and dismissive of the Mets. Then he leaves. And with him goes his nonsense. It's a tough sell to myself sometimes, but I (any of us) only make(s) him bigger by pumping up his balloon. And that takes enough hot air as it is. G-Fafif Apr 13 2009 09:41 AM ="batmagadanleadoff":3288zbut]="G-Fafif":3288zbut]="batmagadanleadoff":3288zbut]I'm a fanatical Met fan and I never, ever, ever listen to Mike Francesca.[/quote:3288zbut] But you shave with Gillette Foamy.[/quote:3288zbut] I was going to get around to quizzing the forum on who the partial head (lower right avatar) belongs to. Any ideas?[/quote:3288zbut] There can only be three of those heads in Mets history, unless it's Harrelson's. (Boisclair?) batmagadanleadoff Apr 13 2009 09:43 AM ="G-Fafif":2o4o9ruz]It's a tough sell to myself sometimes, but I (any of us) only make(s) him bigger by pumping up his balloon. And that takes enough hot air as it is.[/quote:2o4o9ruz] You've got to blow hard to pump up that blowhard. SteveJRogers Apr 13 2009 09:43 AM ="G-Fafif":3dj8h2g0]="batmagadanleadoff":3dj8h2g0]="G-Fafif":3dj8h2g0]="batmagadanleadoff":3dj8h2g0]I'm a fanatical Met fan and I never, ever, ever listen to Mike Francesca.[/quote:3dj8h2g0] But you shave with Gillette Foamy.[/quote:3dj8h2g0] I was going to get around to quizzing the forum on who the partial head (lower right avatar) belongs to. Any ideas?[/quote:3dj8h2g0] There can only be three of those heads in Mets history, unless it's Harrelson's. (Boisclair?)[/quote:3dj8h2g0] I'm apt to guess Kranepool. SteveJRogers Apr 13 2009 09:47 AM ="TransMonk":20ythqx8]I don't need to be spoon fed opinion by talking heads. I'll check in every once in a while to see how much bullshit they are attempting to shovel. I've heard enough of O'Reilly to form my personal opinion that he is a moron and no more informative than a bag of hair. Weak.[/quote:20ythqx8] My point is more that he comes from an investigative journalistic background, being on Inside Edition. Granted he doesn't have Shepard Smith's job or anything, nor did I say I'd put him IN the same category as Shepard Smith. My point was that it is easier to accept the "facts" that O'Reilly brings forth in his opinions, disagree or agree, since he does his homework, then it is on the other two ego-maniacs. Both of whom THINK they are journalists, but in realtiy they are nothing more than talking heads. TransMonk Apr 13 2009 09:55 AM Star Jones used to be on Inside Edition. Geraldo Rivera has an investigative journalist background. Everyone you see on cable news has an agenda whether it is hidden or not. I had always thought you understood this. Bill O'Reilly tailors his facts to support an agenda and/or increase his ratings. Either way, he is an entertainer and not a journalist. Just like Olbermann and Francesa. G-Fafif Apr 13 2009 09:55 AM ="SteveJRogers":j0sdws7b]I'm apt to guess Kranepool.[/quote:j0sdws7b] That we can see. BML's asking about the partial head. batmagadanleadoff Apr 13 2009 10:05 AM The partial head is no longer partial. <--------- TransMonk Apr 13 2009 10:06 AM Looks like a folded Bobby V. G-Fafif Apr 13 2009 10:07 AM Dreamy McMet? Edgy DC Apr 13 2009 10:12 AM Kirk Radomski. seawolf17 Apr 13 2009 10:14 AM We should all change our avatars to be different photos of Bobby Valentine. MFS62 Apr 13 2009 11:17 AM ="batmagadanleadoff":1ylrscgv]I'm a fanatical Met fan and I never, ever, ever listen to Mike Francesca.[/quote:1ylrscgv] And it could get worse. I read in one of the NYpapers last week that Max Kellerman might be Francessa'a new sidekick. http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/messages/chrono/13995936 If you don't know his work, Max is a very knowledgeable boxing guy, and a virulent Yankees fan. He used to taunt Mets fans on his ESPN radio show. Batmagadan, if this happens it will be just one more reason not to listen. Later John Cougar Lunchbucket Apr 13 2009 11:40 AM Kellerman is OK in my book. He's learned in the language of the intelligent fan, and it might be interesting to see how much old-school, counting-stat ignorance he could take from his idiotic co-host before a fight breaks out. OlerudOwned Apr 13 2009 11:49 AM Bill O'Reilly does some fantastic[/url:3byf6op8] reporting[/url:3byf6op8]. Between this and the Roger Craig thing, geez. Centerfield Apr 13 2009 12:09 PM ="SteveJRogers":3k5gyx3b]="TransMonk":3k5gyx3b] Someone who respects what any of these blowhards (Francesa, O'Reilly, Olbermann) say as an authority on anything other than entertainment and shock value needs to re-evaluate their views on reality.[/quote:3k5gyx3b] O'Reilly is more of a reporter than Francesa (actually he has been getting better since loosing the Dog) and Olbermann ever were. Maybe you should watch instead of getting your info from haters on message boards and whatnot.[/quote:3k5gyx3b] Yes, that is correct. Stevie Jeets just told someone to spend less time on message boards. metsfanbook Apr 13 2009 07:17 PM For years I've been thinking that all I have to do is not listen to Francesa. And for years I've listened to Francesa because when I'm driving home from work, I would like to be entertained by listening to something that has something to do with baseball. For years I've despised Francesa but I was entertained because the Mike and the Mad Dog thing could be diverting, if not illuminating. Now that Francesa sits there alone in profoundly boring isolation, I am out of patience and this has led me to wonder if it was possible for WFAN to figure out that there would be a market for a thoughtful, fair, partisan pro-Mets radio host in the afternoon, somebody in the mold of Gary Cohen or Howie Rose. Unfair partisan programming can be fun when it's done with flair, style, and intelligence, and when you essentially agree with the host, which is why I'm a fan of Keith Olbermann, even though I acknowledge that he's an entertainer and not a journalist. I've listened to O'Reilly a few times and I think that he could actually learn some things from Francesa when it comes to manipulating difficult concepts, collecting and evaluating evidence, and constructing persuasive arguments. Still, fair, analytical partisan programming is, to me, even more entertaining than partisan noise. Isn't there somebody out there they could hire who could give us on talk radio something like what we get from the Mets broadcasters? Dana Brand Edgy DC Apr 13 2009 07:45 PM Welcome back, professor. metirish Apr 13 2009 08:38 PM I would urge you to call Francesa Dana but he would only hang up on you so don't. metsfanbook Apr 13 2009 09:14 PM I fantasize about calling Francesa and saying that I'm a long-time listener but not a fan. Hell, I have been listening to him ever since he replaced Pete Franklin twenty years ago. If I'm not a fan, how do I explain this? Like Greg says, WFAN is like Lojack. Benjamin Grimm Apr 14 2009 06:25 AM I quit WFAN four years ago, and never looked back. There's so much better stuff on the radio. For your own individual sanity, I urge you to stop listening. Edgy DC Apr 14 2009 07:11 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Apr 14 2009 07:57 AM That's the thing. After a certain amount of time away, if you stumble back in, your thinking is, "How did I ever tolerate this insanity/" It's like coming back home to a fucked up family after a time away. You acknowledge and tolerate, and may even laugh in a detached way at some of their fucked-up antics, but you know you can never allow that to be part of your life again, and you can actually feel the pain leaving your body as you decompress afterwards. metsguyinmichigan Apr 14 2009 07:51 AM That's a neat blog, professor. I'll check back often and I'm looking forward to the book.

I ate the shit out of some fish fry on Friday thinking of the end of last season the whole time. I hoped they learned their lesson.

FWIW, Florida looks better than I expected them to. The NL East could get even more competitive. And Johnson was very, very impressive.

LWFS was right about the outfield D today. God, that Murphy error sucked.

Cole Hamels pulled after 3.2 IP: 11 H, 7 ER, 1 BB, 1 K, 1 HR 17.18 ERA I don't feel as bad about Perez's start now. COL leads 7-2 after 4 innings.

A smattering of late afternoon starts today including: MFYs at KC Phillies at COL and Braden Looper making his Milwaukee debut against the Cubs at Miller Park.

Based on history: for every start that Ollie has like the one he had today he will give us a gem (likely against the Braves). If Maine looks decent tomorrow, I'll feel better about today. I still feel that if our 1-4 pitchers can put up similar numbers to last season, we will be fine. At least Livan is durable and predictable...which will make him easier to watch for me than Perez and Maine.